I'm suprised the Wie cult have not jumped all over this. Maybe they are boycotting Chris, because it's easier to cry jealousy and sour grapes than face the facts. Until Ms. Wie wins, which for the record I believe she will someday on the LPGA Tour she will simply be known as a spindly young girl with a ton of potential who couldn't measure up to the hype.

People predicted you won't wait until sony to rip wie. Obviously they knew something.
Anyway Didn't Morgan declair her goal is winning Q school, not simply earning card? When I checked, Morgan was drilled by Ai Miyazato by 14 strokes. I never thought you would praise a girl finished 14 strokes behind leader.
Also Morgan finished big names like Libby smith, Lee ann Walker-Cooper, Brooke Tull,Katie Futcher. Can I say "overhyped"?

Also are you saying Herb Krickstein gets it? Definitely he knows how to ruin phenom. Does anybody Remmeber what happened to his son?

Finishing 6th in Q-School accomplishes the same goal as winning, Gaining an LPGA Tour Card. So while Morgan may not have played as well as she would have liked, she did actually accomplish something, unlike Wie who last time I checked has been handed most everything she has ever gotten. Oh, by the way Aaron Krickstien had a pretty decent career winning the junior national championship, nine pro titles, reaching a top ranking of #6 world all in an career cut short by injury. Yeah, Herb Krickstien really raised a loser and did a Michelle Wie fan just use the term, "overhyped" to describe someone else---gotta love the irony.

I'd take Michelle Wie's 3 -Top 5 finishes in the LPGA tour this summer over Morgan Pressel's 6th place finish at Q school any day.

Aaron Krickstein-how many grand slams did he win ?

Not to get political , but you know that the Pressel family in Florida especially "Gramps" are very active right wing ultra Conservatives right.
Let's just say they don't have the best record concerning racial issues here ....

Baldwin and Pressel have a lot in common---

the only way they can get any kind of attention is if they slam Michelle Wie in the media.

Anyone heard of either Pressel or Baldwin unitl they both decided to ride Michelle's coattails---

The funny thing is Michelle could care less...

Please stop these futile anti-Wie comments.
Your facts are wrong and, therefore, your argument is completely pointless.
Move on to something you actually have some knowledge of and leave the Michelle Wie critics to themselves. At least they know what their talking about.
Fool.

For all of you supercilious morons who have been drinking the Wie "Kool Aid" and particularly Ken who sees a "Ultra Right Wing Conspiracy behind each golf bag. Let's let their records after next year do the talking. Can anyone tell me why Wie was not in the LPGA Q School?

What has Wie got to do with Pressels Grandfather.
Wie doesn't want to play full time on the LPGA so why should she care what the age limit is.
Only playing 8 events suits her plans, it leaves her time to play on the PGA and lucrative invitations in other countries like Japan.
Wie probably earned more for 1 appearance in Japan than Cramer did from a sucessful years tournament earnings and she was second on the money list.
Figure it out it's not difficult.

And again for the record based on her finishes in the LPGA events Wie played in this year she would be ranked 2nd to Anika.
Alan M

mike,

you seem to be suggesting that wie did not enter q school becuase she wasn't as great as pressel. i think the media-generated rival between these two would be interesting to watch the next year. however, to answer you question wie wasn't in q school because she does not want to become a full-fledge lpga member yet. if she is a member, she has to play a certain amount of tournaments, something her schedule does not allow her to do. however, by not committing to the lpga, she can play in any event she desired (although limit lpga events i believe is 8)and also play in pga tournamets according to her schedule. she's only a highschool student, and i guess it's not bad if she prioritized her education first.

p.s. Chris the only reason you bash Wie is to get comments. here's a pity comment for you.

You've sunk to a new low Baldie--

after attacking a 16 year old for pursuing her dreams, you now attack her Dad too.

Pathetic...

Chris is really talented. To make up a story insulting Wie, after Pressel finished 14 strokes behind the lead is really imaginative. Well done.

Pressel was at the lpga q-school to win the tournament. That's what she said. She did pretty bad in that quest, but at least she qualified.

Chris you talk about the Michelle Wie hype, but what about this:
On a tv golf show, it was mentioned that Pressel qualified from the lpga tour school and it showed her taking a few shots. There was absolutely no mention of anyone else. No mention of Ai Miyazato who won it by 12 shots from the field.
That's what I call Pressel-mania hype.

As the immortal Al Davis said, "Just Win Baby". Alan I think I have figured it out---Wie and her handlers..I mean parents and Nike care about the money, the hype, and the marketing machine she has become. It's the reason that she seldom competed against those her own age, and the same reason she is attempting to compete against the men. if she loses to the men people like you will say how great she played for a little girl, but if she loses to kids her own age which she has than there is no excuse. Her results have been impressive on the LPGA, but no more impressive than those of Pressel's and Creamer's. Oh and to the fool(Ken) who implies that the Krieckstein family is ultra-right wing conservative and racist---I know Herb Krickstien from our country club in CT. that would be our Jewish Country Club, he like many of us is a member there because we could not get into non-jewish clubs in the area based on our religious beliefs. An ultra-right wing conservative Republican Jew, that's a new one. you want to make Baldwin shut-up just have Michelle win something...anything.

Matt, maybe we should rethink our position. Maybe the Wie cabal has it right. After all, to BJ and the rest of the Wie entourage, money is the ONLY consideration. Why should their precocious charge be exposed to a bunch of her predatory peers and the possibility of embarrassment when she can drag down $1M in "appearance money" for missing the cut in what can best be described as a minor men's tournament? Incidentally, the Casio did not have one player in it ranked in the top 250 worldwide, in fact, the field contained only 98 players, none of the top ten Japanese golfers, The top 60 and ties made the cut. MW didn't. But, so what? BJ got the cash! In the category of over-hyping, perhaps the most egregious instance of 2005 occurred during the telecast of the John Deere, another missed cut for Michelle Wie. On the segment called "shot of the day", a replay of MW pitching from about 40 yards to within three feet of from the hole was given the title of "shot of the day". A few minutes later the network aired a replay of a spectacular hole-in-one by Shigeki Maruyama, shot that same day about an hour before MW's masterpiece.

John---Thank you for writing. I was beginning to lose faith in my fellow man. Criticize Michelle Wie and you are jealous, sexist, racist or worse. Could I be all these things? Or am I just a golf enthusiast who likes to see results, wins and hard work be the motivating factors in deciding our next superstars. Michelle has been put on the mountain top and I'm not sure how she got there; raw talent? potential? Not wins and accomplishment that I do know.

Comment from: Ken [Visitor]

*Not to get political*

Although in true hypocritical fashion, that is precisely what you did...

*but you know that the Pressel family in Florida especially "Gramps" are very active right wing ultra Conservatives right.*

And that is relevant to golf ... how?

*Let's just say they don't have the best record concerning racial issues here*

So what are you saying, exactly? If you're a conservative, you're a racist? Could you say anything dumber? Then again, let's just give you time.

Or are you saying there is proof that Grandpa Krickstein and/or granddaughter Morgan are racists?

If so, what is that evidence?

If you don't have it, retract your statement.

Or you could be a coward and just be silent.

Or are you saying that blond and Nordic-looking = Aryan nation types?

If so, be sure to forward your quaint Third Reich theories to blondes like Jack Nicklaus. You probably figure the "Golden Bear" avoids talking to Tiger Woods, right Herr Ken?

-George

Politics aside...

What the heck does Michelle Wie have to do with any of this ?

We're talking about Pressel finishing 6th in Q-school--Wie was hundreds of miles away in the 11th grade.

Baldwin -you need to get a life !

Pressel is so jealous of Michelle Wie -she can't even see straight.

Her comments about Michelle have been catty and immature and that certainly does not qualify her as being confident .

If anything it shows how insecure she is.

GOLF SUCKS AND

MORGAN PRESSEL LOOKS LIKE CHARLIE WEIS IN DRAG!!

Comment from: matt [Visitor]
* Michelle has been put on the mountain top and I'm not sure how she got there; raw talent? potential? Not wins and accomplishment that I do know. *

There was a moment when It could have been Morgan vs. Michelle in 2005. Had Michelle just skipped the Women's British Open she could have faced off against her peers, including Pressel in the U.S. Women's Amateur.

Instead, Michelle entered two overseas tournaments in which she finished at a great distance from the winner in both cases. Wie might have been a top 10 finisher at Evian and the British Open, but Wie failed to challenge either Creamer or Jang -- or anyone -- down the stretch. In neither case was Wie in the final pairing.

But the Women's Amateur is a tournament Wie would be actually *expected* to win, or at least be a top contender. Instead of putting it on the line and shutting up Pressel once and for all, Wie ducked Morgan and was conveniently unavailable for a tournament that would pit Wie against her peers.

I am not criticizing B.J. Wie's strategy. The goal clearly was to strike while the iron was hot and make Michelle and her family fabulously wealthy. They succeeded, and as I have said multiple times elsewhere, good for them.

The Wies and everyone else should make as much money as possible legally. Everyone should be rich and everyone should make more money than they do now. That's my free-market philosophy.

But it is also clear that the strategy is for Michelle to create as much buzz and make as much money as possible without getting into the dreary grind of being on a tour full-time.

In fact, entering high-profile events that Michelle has little chance of winning is all part of the strategy. Whether she wins or loses works just as well. If Wie wins (in the near term), she becomes the youngest LPGA winner ever. If Wie loses, then the cry from the Wie Warriors is "Don't criticize Michelle: Michelle is only xxTeen years old."

This is truly a win-win situation in which Michelle cannot lose no matter what she does.

And even better, turning pro PRECLUDES Michelle from competing in amateur events where it would be easier to measure her accomplishments. And she's too young to be a full-time LPGA member for at least 2-3 years, unless they change the rules specially for Michelle.

Even if she becomes a full-time LPGA member someday and still doesn't win, the story line for at least a couple of years will be, "What do you expect, Sorenstam, Creamer, Pressel, Miyazako, Gulbis, Kerr, (fill in the blank of a successful pro golfer) have more tour experience."

We already hear that now: "Michelle is rusty. That's why she didn't win. She doesn't play often enough."

That's an excuse that will serve well for the next 3-4 years.

So again, please understand. I applaud the get-rich gambit, because it worked, and it was legal.

But it's also time for the Wie Warriors who are fanatic drinkers of the Wie Kool Aid -- which is every one of the Wie Warriors -- to concede that this is the strategy.

The strategy for at least the next few years is to avoid all tournaments in which Michelle is a favorite. Enter only tournaments that fuel more hype and buzz.

That way, Wie's stumbles will not tarnish her mystique.

-George

Sheryl, Baldwin doesn't have a life outside bashing Michelle. That is a plain and simple fact.

Matt,
I find it very disingenuous that you are being critical of Michelle Wie in this blog now that you've outed youself as a friend of the Pressel and Krickstein family.

At least Michelle Wie's family, friends and handlers have conducted themselves with class and dignity and have NEVER said anything derogatory about Morgan Pressel.

I definitely cannot say the same for Morgan Pressel who has insulted and disrespected Michelle Wie in the press every opportunity she has gotten. And I certainly cannot say the same about you after seeing your comments on this blog regarding Michelle.

Maybe you can tell your friend Herb next time you see him at the country club that his daughter needs to conduct herself better.

Matt got owned!

Matt

Just curious-don't take this as attacking you but
do they allow female members or people of color in that country club of yours ?

And yes George--I think most conservatives are racist .

OK guys-- no more politics please

Lets just talk about something we all agree on

Chris Baldwin is a LOSER !

Kendra:
*I think most conservatives are racist*

Behold the intelligence of the typical Wie Warrior!

If the Wie Warriors held a Mensa contest, you would win, Kendra!

When I asked Ken if he could possible say something dumber, I didn't think he would get trumped so quickly!

-George

Chris. where is your new masterpiece " Ai Miyazato was always better than pressel and will always be better than pressel"?
Ai Miyazato drilled your girl by 14 strokes and Ai will beat pressel by even bigger margin in more important category : "class"

George

You're offended by someone stereotyping all conservatives as racist yet you turn around and
stereotype "typical Wie Warriors" as dumb.

Its called hypocrisy--look it up if don't know what it means.

George said:
*************************
There was a moment when It could have been Morgan vs. Michelle in 2005. Had Michelle just skipped the Women's British Open she could have faced off against her peers, including Pressel in the U.S. Women's Amateur.

Instead, Michelle entered two overseas tournaments in which she finished at a great distance from the winner in both cases. Wie might have been a top 10 finisher at Evian and the British Open, but Wie failed to challenge either Creamer or Jang -- or anyone -- down the stretch. In neither case was Wie in the final pairing.

****************************

George, you think Michelle Wie should have given up the Evian (5th major) and the British Open (a major) to compete in some amatuer tournament?
Even if she just gave up the British Open. Lets say she actually won this amatuer tournament and beat Pressel. What would would that have done her? Finishing 3rd in the womens British Open was FAR ahead of winning an amatuer tournament.
British Open is A MAJOR.

Do you honestly believe ANY golfer would give up the chance at the British Open to play this other tournament?
Perhaps Paula Creamer should have not turned professional when she did, and retained her amatuer status and entered it too?

George
Why would Wie play in an amateur event given the chance to play at the British Open, Duh a bit of a no brainer wouldn't you say.
Finishing 2nd and 3rd is hardly a poor effort.
Can you name one person who had two better results at the Evian and British open.
As a Wie warrior it is great reading all the crap that comes on this blog knowing that one day I can write "I told you so"
By then she may have earned $100m travelling round in her own private jet. I wish I could be a loser like her.
Just remember she is such a sucess because of her fans. Isn't that what sport is all about.

Alan M

Alan, welcome to the upside down world of the Wie bashers. Wie tries to play against the best players she can and they call her a coward. If she tries to challenge herself so she can improve in the long term, they say she should take an easier path so she can win more quickly. They just hate to see someone try something new for fear she'll succeed.

alan,
I agree!!!

"I don't see why she's out trying to make cuts every week," Pressel said of Wie. "I don't see the reason for that. It's for the publicity."

"If she's good enough to win a men's event, more power to her...but I have serious doubts that can be done." - Aaron Krickstein

In another interview, Krickstein expressed loud bewilderment over Michelle's popularity. Pressel/Krickstein are not role models for class. Why is it so important to them to sound off to the media about a 16 year old girl, as if knocking her would enhance Morgan's public standing (or attract sponsors). Michelle is younger, but shows so much more maturity. She's graceful and articulate. I would root for Morgan if she didn't act so nasty.

Jealousy I guess...if you enter "Morgan Pressel" in Google you get 81,300 hits. For "Michelle Wie" it's 924,000. Maybe they're all in a snit they're losing the battle of "hearts and minds"?

So many questions to answer, so much anger to address. Kendra, we have a number of female members, including our former President of the Board. There are no African-American Memebers currently. There is nothing disingenous about defending the honor of a gentleman who is neither racist nor an ultra-conservative. He is simply a father who raised an extremely talented son and a loving grandfather to an equally talented young lady. Do I agree with everything that Morgan Pressel has said, absolutely not, but you have to remember that Pressel was the orinial Wie. She was the youngest ever to qualify for the Women's Open, she has won every junior and amatuer title possible, petitioned to go to Q-school early and earned her LPGA Tour card through hard work---All the while Wie hits some big drives, fails to win some tournaments, misses the cut in some men's events and she is the one with the huge endoresment deal and the tag of the next big thing. Bitter? maybe. Jealous of the attention on Wie? probably. A brat? sometimes. Think back to when you were 17 we all said things we regret. Wie and her father have made numerous disperaging remarks to fellow LPGA players, junior competition and the like. Never forget though that Morgan has earned every bit of her hype, the same can not be said of Wie. Will wie be better than Pressel, who knows, but right now I would take the fiery competitor over the overhyped girl with the tendency to fade when the going gets tough and cry when the big kids don't play nice.

Kendra, None of this political claptrap has anything to do with golf, but do you really believe that since most members of our Armed Forces are conservatives, that most of our young men in uniform are racists? Now, it is possible that a couple of rabid right wingers like Mr. Pressel and Herb Krickstein, being from Florida, might be connected to the conservative hurricane machine....

"Wie and her father have made numerous disperaging remarks to fellow LPGA players, junior competition and the like "

Matt, I've followed golf for many years, and I honestly have not heard either Michelle or her Dad disparage anyone publicly in the manner you have said. In fact, its very much the other way around.

I do agree with you Pressel is only 17, I'm going to give her a pass on some of her catty behavior. I do hope she grows out of it soon though, she makes it very hard to root for her when she is so disrespectful of the competition. Its not really Michelle's fault she gets the lion share of the attention, so Morgan should focus her anger on the sports media, and the like.

Matt. You said pressel was original wie. You are right and that's the problem. Pressel was media darling before wie and all of sudden lost spot light to wie. Pressel was hollywood kid star who lost her popularity to new kid and that would bring out all the jealousy toward new kid star. Now if Herb really knew how to raise kid, He should have controlled that jealousy but instead he fanned that jealousy. Krickstein family simply ripped wie family everytime they have chance to talk to media.
I can understand where Herb's animosity toward wie family comes from. He expected his son to be a big thing but his son's career never blossomed the way he expected. Now he thought he got second chance from his granddaughter but there came another new kid with more natural talent which his granddaughter simply didn't possess. Obviously he should have been frustrated and his frustration led to animosity toward wie family.
Now can pressel really keep playing if it becomes apparent that she will never beat wie? Even worse what would happen if pressel can not even beat Ai Miyazato? I won't be surprised if pressel's carrer is over within 5 years unless she can get rid of her unhealthy animosiy toward fellow competitors.

And check who has more records related to "qualifying" . You might be surprised to find out how many qualifying records player who was supposedely handed everything.

Matt,
Just as I thought. You know nothing about Wie. I have followed her career since she was 11, read every article I could find on her, listened to every interview she has given in public. I have NEVER read or heard her say any negative about anyone except perhaps D Amacaccapane. I CHALLENGE you to show proof of any disparaging remarks Wie has made about anyone else in public. If you can, I will apologize profusely for each one. If you cannot, I expect you to apologize for your error.

Matt, u r such a loooooooser!!!

Don't be so hard on Matt-he's not that bad.

Its Chris Baldwin and George that are the douche bags!

j, the contest for the most inane and incongruous comment is now officially over. The judges have declared you the winner of all the prizes, in fact, you have retired the trophy. Now we think it is time for you to return to your sandbox. We adults would appreciate some sensible repartee. Thank you.

No waaay j you are the looooser. Sorry, thought I was back in Junior High for a second. Listen---I have a tremendous amount of respect for Michelle Wie, she has a world of talent and seems destined for greatness this much is not in question. What is in question is the path she has chosen to take to ultimately achieve that greatness. Should she have focused on winning at the junior level, then the amatuer level, then the women's tour and then ultimately perhaps set her sights on the men. I personally think so, but thats just my opinion. It is a model that has worked for people like Tiger Woods and Paula Creamer just to name a couple. To me playing against the best competition you can find is admirable, but losing begats losing and no matter how well she plays against the men ultimately she will lose, even if she makes the cut she will not be gaining the much needed experience of needing to make a crucial putt, chip, approach, whatever to win. She has played beautifully in LPGA sponser exemption events finishing second in a number of them---would she have won be now with the experience, knowledge and confidence that comes with winning at other levels---that is the argument, not whether or not Michelle Wie is going to be great(she is). Vernon, for the record she and her father have often told reporters that Michelle did not compete against kids her own age because there would be no point, saying that she would dominate them and that their talent level is not even worth mentioning against her's. This of course is arogant and untrue. Does this make Michelle a jerk, no it makes her cocky just like Morgan Pressel and Paula Creamer and frankly you need a little bit of that to succed. You are right about one thing, Wie is handled better than Pressel--in fact we know precious little about the real Michelle Wie--we only know what her father, William Moris agency, Sony and Nike want us to know. So regardless of how long you have been following Michelle Wie's career(since 11 Vernon, a little creepy) you know nothing about her either. She is a slickly marketed young girl with loads of talent, but as of yet little substance. Thanks, Jack for recognizing that differing opinions don't make somebody a bad person.

Matt. "hype" is earned by achieving extraordinary thing. pressel family and her fans just don't want admit Wie earned hype because she did extraordinary things. Instead they want to believe there should be other reason for hype (because wie is minority?)and obviously Herb has been inserting that distorted idea to his granddaughter.

Simply look at the facts.
Morgan has one record related to qualifying. She was youngest to qualify for women's open.
Meanwhile, wie was youngest to qualify for USGA championship when she qualfied for women's publinx at 10.
Wie was youngest player to monday qualify for lpga tournament at 12. She qualified not once but twice when she was 12.
Wie is only female player ever to qualify for men's usga championship. Now who do you think has more qualifying records?

Let's talk about records in major. Wie recorded 4 top 10(2nd,3rd,4th and 9th finish each) in major before her 16th birthday. Morgan made one "cut" before her 16th birthday. Can you name any player who recorded 2 top 10,let alone 4 top10 finish in major before 16th birthday? Now do you know why Wie gets more press than Morgan?
Yes, Morgan was runner up in women's open but wie already had runner up finish in major. Yes, morgan won women's amateur but that's not exactly extraordinary performance which deserves hype. Last year's winner Jane park was also 17 year old and nobody cared. Wie won USGA adult championship at 13 and no player younger than 16 old ever won Adult championship before. That's what you call extraordinary.

Qualifying versus Winning, Publinx versus US women's Amatuer. Come on Jay are you kidding me. Morgan Pressel won the career grand slam of American Junior Golf that's all five of the most prestigous tournaments and The Women's Amat Open the most prestigous women's amatuer event in the world. Wie won no major junior tournamnts and The Women's Pub linx he least prestigous amat title. Qualifying records are nice, but they are not wins and never will be and mean precious little when you qualify and get smoked. You can argue that Wie will be the better of the two in the future, fine, you can argue that Pressel needs to focus less on talking trash and more on playing golf, you can even argue tht Wie's results have been slightly better on the LPGA tour thus far, but you can not argue that she has accomplished more to this point in her career, because she has not. i love the argument from all the Wie people---she almost made the cut against men, she almost won a tournament, she almost beat the boys. Enough of the almosts and youngest and qualifies WIN.

Matt said:
*******************************
She has played beautifully in LPGA sponser exemption events finishing second in a number of them---would she have won be now with the experience, knowledge and confidence that comes with winning at other levels---that is the argument, not whether or not Michelle Wie is going to be great(she is).
*******************************

I think this is where you are missing the point. In my opinion, if she had consentrated on amatuer titles, sure she would have won a couple of titles.
However if she took the road you suggest, she wouldn't even have been playing in many lpga events, so how could she have won by now?
By taking the road she has, she is gaining valuable experience, that will probably help her win earlier in the lpga than anyone else has so far.

Please anyone who has any doubts, look just above this post as Jay's post, where the facts are stated, about how much Wie has achieved quicker in her career than Pressel.
That is why Wie has the hype, because of all she has achieved in comparison to others at that stage of their careers.

Matt said:
Qualifying records are nice, but they are not wins and never will be and mean precious little when you qualify and get smoked.
*****************************

But of course Pressel qualifying out of q-school is brilliant.

matt
Michelle lives in Hawaii.
She dominated that competition. Do you really think she would travel to the mainland on a regular basis to compete at a junior level when she could be competing against the best professionals in the world Male and Female.
She has chosen a different approach, why can't people just accept it for what it is? jealously plain and simple.
I assume you play golf. If this weekend you have the choice of playing a round with your pals or Ernie Els who would you choose?

Alan M

Matt said:
i love the argument from all the Wie people---she almost made the cut against men, she almost won a tournament, she almost beat the boys. Enough of the almosts and youngest and qualifies WIN.
****************************

but when Morgan Pressel almost won the US womens open, that was brilliant.

I think we are getting a pattern here.

If Morgan Pressel does something it's great, if Michelle Wie does the same thing it is useless.

It would seem that several posters on this board think that it is not only possible but highly likely that Michelle Wie will, sometime in the not-too-distant future, be able to compete successfully against the best male players on the planet. Not against the up-and-comers on the Hooters' tour, the Canadian tour, or even the Nationwide tour, mind you. No sirree! They will be satisfied with nothing less than an occasional MW win on the PGA tour sandwiched in among several top tens. Just how these miracles will be accomplished remains a mystery. Biologically, it is virtually impossible for any female to ever develop the strength and manual and physical dexterity of a male of comparable age an athletic ability. Similarly, women do not have the emotional makeup to develop the aggressiveness, competitive spirit, or "killer instincts" of PGA pros. Therefore, barring the ingestion and/or injection of harmful steroids and HGH, I see only one way for MW's cadre of supporters to level the playing field. The Wie Warriors must petition the powers that be to repeal Gregor Mendel's Laws of Heredity and Genetics. They are outdated anyway, having been formulated in the 1850's. The basis for lawsuits can be either "evolution" or "intelligent design". Not to pursue this course of action would be "sexist" and in MW's case "racist".

Please--I no longer wish to argue Morgan Pressel vs. Michelle Wie. Time will tell who has the better career. I think they both will be great. Tiger Woods and I simply believe that Michelle might have been better served playing and dominating her peers, thats all. I think we can all agree dominating Hawaii/local golf is not the same as dominating The American Junior Golf Association level talent. Alan to answer your question I do play golf and used to play competitively and have actually had the honor and privlege to play with Mr. Els at Westchester Country Club and if I wanted an experience I would play again with Ernie Els, if I wanted to win and have a true chance of competing I would play with my friends and there is the crux of my argument. I respectfully disagree with the argument that playing with and losing to superior competition is better than learning how to compete and win against your peers or the level of competition that you are currently at. There is no shame in losing at any level I know I have done enough of it and it is true that you should learn something each time you lose, but you also learn something when you win and that is how to win and it is an imporatnt skill one which Michelle for all her future greatness does not posses now. I am not jealous of Michelle Wie and the talent she posseses. I am happy with contending in my club championship. I am not jealous of the lucrative contracts she has signed or the money she will earn. I have done very well in life and have no financial complaints or worries. I am simply expressing my opinion, one which seems to be an unpopular one, but it is one which is not malicious or sexist or racist. I wish Michelle Wie the best. I just come from a background were accomplishment merited reward, not promise and talent. It seems Michelle's fans and they are fans in the true sense of the word(fanatic) just assume that she will soon dominate women's golf and even truly compete against men. I just prefer to wait and see before I crown her the chosen one.

John Zelda said:
Biologically, it is virtually impossible for any female to ever develop the strength and manual and physical dexterity of a male of comparable age an athletic ability. Similarly, women do not have the emotional makeup to develop the aggressiveness, competitive spirit, or "killer instincts" of PGA pros.
****************************

Have you read any of my comments?
I don't think any sane person would argue that men are much physically stronger than women. Add to that faster.
If something reqires mainly physcial strenth, men will be better than it.

With golf, physical strength is an advantage. However it is not a critical enough, to mean that women cannot compete with men.

As regards the instinct to finish the job, Annika has that undenyable will to win. It can be argued that quite a high percentage of men on the pga tour don't have it.
Look at finishes any week on any mens tour and you will see people stumbling and missing easy shots when the pressure is on.

Golf is not boxing. It is not wresting, judo, soccer, tennis, basketball, football, hammer throwing or weight-lifting.

Golf is predominantly a game of skill.

Matt, even though j thinks you are a loser, you do belong to a country club, albeit with those right wing racists Pressel and Krickstein. Now you've really outed yourself as an elitist snob with your admission that you played with Ernie at---horror of horrors---Westchester! Kendra ain't gonna like that! You must be one of those lucky guys who won life's lottery. When you give j the number 12, are you referring to his age or his IQ?

Matt said:
Tiger Woods and I simply believe that Michelle might have been better served playing and dominating her peers, thats all.
****************************

Please furnish us with a link to the article from where Tiger said that she should play against her peers.

Matt said:
I respectfully disagree with the argument that playing with and losing to superior competition is better than learning how to compete and win against your peers or the level of competition that you are currently at. There is no shame in losing at any level I know I have done enough of it and it is true that you should learn something each time you lose, but you also learn something when you win and that is how to win and it is an imporatnt skill one which Michelle for all her future greatness does not posses now.
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If Michelle "learns to win" on the amatuer stage, does that mean she then knows how to win at a higher level? No it doesn't.
She would have to learn all over again. Morgan Pressel winning amatuer titles and Morgan Pressel winning lpga events are 2 different things.
By the way, I think Pressel has a great chance of winning on the lpga next season, and being the youngest winner.

John--Times are tough for anyone who dares question the Wie marketing train as it rolls on carrying the greatest player to have never won anything of note, but when I get called a "loooooser" by a middle-school drop-out then it's time to defend myself. My grandfather came to this country with nothing and worked hard to provide a better life for his children. My father worked equally hard putting himself through law school while working as many as three jobs at a time. I did the same having nothing given to me on my way through life. I didn't get where I am today by simply "qualifying" for law school or finishing 2nd in my class or even just trying to "make the cut" at my law firm. I did it by striving to be the best at each stage of development. Confident, outspoken at times, even arrogant, but that's what it took and that's what it takes in the world of competitive golf. Michelle Wie has taken a different path and all we can do is sit back and see if it works.

Michelle's path has worked pretty well so far.

http://www.pgatour.com/story/6995547

Norman, midway through the story Tiger is quoted as saying that he belives winning tournaments at the lower levels provide invaluable experience and that Michelle should have done that as he and Phil Mickleson did. Vijay also believes this to be the best way to prepare yourself for success. I know you find it shocking that people disagree with the you and the Wie machines way of doing things, but there is room for differing opinions about how to achieve success. My ideas are backed by the best golfers in the world, your's are backed by teenage boys and girls, a crazy stage father and a 16 year-old girl.

Are you talking about her path to endorement riches and fame or are you talking about her career win total--because one path has been extremely succsesful, the other is still a work in progress.

Comment from: Lisa [Visitor]
*****
George

You're offended by someone stereotyping all conservatives as racist yet you turn around and
stereotype "typical Wie Warriors" as dumb.

*****

Are YOU offended by your fellow Wie Warrior sterotyping all conservatives as racists? If somebody calls the Krickstein-Pressel clan racists without specific evidence, are YOU offended by that?

If not, then, yeah, that's a dumb thing to say and/or believe.

And don't forget, some of the criticism directed at Wie skeptics includes accusations that the skeptics are bigoted against Michelle Wie because she's Asian. People like Jim Coulthard and others make those accusations.

Never mind that I and a lot of other Wie skeptics are fans of Tiger Woods, who the last time I was aware, is non-white.

So here's your chance, Lisa.

Either:
1. embrace the blanket racist accusations by letting them stand unchallenged.
2. denounce the blanket racist accusations.
3. be a coward and say nothing.

If you choose #2, then you are an example of a Wie Warrior who is not so drunk with the Wie Kool Aid that you are capable of some rational thought.

Otherwise, the racist paranoia and stereotyping spewed by Herr Ken and Fraulein Kendra will stand as is.

Let's see how many of the Wie Warriors have the class to speak out against such drivel.

-George

George, I don't believe there is any racism involved in any of this. I haven't even bothered to mention it so far, because I think it is just ridiculous talk.

There are many reasons some people don't like Wie, and there are many other reasons some people like her but disagree with her chosen path. Racism doesn't come into it.

** Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
Michelle's path has worked pretty well so far. **

Norman, I applaud you for agreeing with me.

Wie's path has worked well. She is fabulously wealthy and that's great.

Wie's path, though, has been meticulously constructed to avoid the unpleasant mine fields of -- for the most part -- competing against her peers.

My take: Wie ducked Morgan Pressel this summer at the Amateur Open because Wie didn't want to take the chance of losing to somebody or a group of somebodies that conventional wisdom would favor Wie to beat. B.J. Wie did have a good cover story, though.

One can't fault Wie to take a fun road trip to a French resort and a storied links course in the U.K. instead of the plebian grind of a course in Georgia.
Especially since there were no expectations for Wie in France and the U.K., whereas there would have been in the plebian grind in Georgia.

And Norman, I am pleased to see you have joined me in congratulating Paula Creamer as a winner of a LPGA Major tournament, Evian.

Paula BESTED a prestigious field in that one, Norman.

One wonders, how did that bit of praise for Paula Creamer slip through your keyboard? The doctors won't be happy if you missed your Wie Kool Aid medication today?

-George

Matt, I accept your sources in that link, they are all genuine.

That story was taken before Michelle's first pga event. Maybe some players have changed their minds, maybe others haven't.

The issue now is not whether she should do amatuer or pro, because amatuer is now gone.

The issue is pga events or just lpga events.
There are good arguments on both sides.

On one hand, she shouldn't compete on the pga because she cannot win, so what is the point in playing there.

I disagree with this, because for everyone who has made it, they had absolutely no chance of winning either at the start.
I accept that there is one major difference with Wie. In Tiger's case a win was possible sonner. For Wie it is years away, if at all.

However, I think the experience is invaluable and she should grab it (and the money) with both hands.

George said:
My take: Wie ducked Morgan Pressel this summer at the Amateur Open because Wie didn't want to take the chance of losing to somebody or a group of somebodies that conventional wisdom would favor Wie to beat. B.J. Wie did have a good cover story, though.
****************************

George, why do you say the same things when you were already proven wrong.

For Wie to enter an amatuer tournament instead of a womens major would be absolutely ridiculous.

As regards Paula Creamer I have praised her on many occasions. She is a very fine player.
I have also stated that she has performed better than Wie in the 2nd half of this season, even if not the whole season.

I have also made the prediction that Paula will perform better than Michelle in the tournaments that they play together next season.

Lisa:
* yet you turn around and stereotype "typical Wie Warriors" as dumb. *

*****
Comment from: j [Visitor]
Matt, u r such a loooooooser!!!

Comment from: Jack [Visitor]
Its Chris Baldwin and George that are the douche bags!

Comment from: Lisa [Visitor]
Chris Baldwin is a LOSER !

Comment from: j [Visitor]
alan, I agree!!!

Comment from: Ken [Visitor]
Not to get political , but you know that the Pressel family in Florida especially "Gramps" are very active right wing ultra Conservatives right.
Let's just say they don't have the best record concerning racial issues here

Comment from: Jon [Visitor]
Matt got owned!

Comment from: Bozza [Visitor]
Please stop these futile anti-Wie comments. Your facts are wrong and, therefore, your argument is completely pointless.

(Bozza, BTW, offered no refutation to Baldwin. I guess we're just supposed to take Bozza's word for it!)

Comment from: Kendra [Visitor]
Yes George--I think most conservatives are racist .

And of course, things wouldn't be complete with yet more empty-headedness from June, who finally has some serious rivals among the Wie Warrior "Mensas"

Comment from: June [Visitor]
Sheryl, Baldwin doesn't have a life outside bashing Michelle. That is a plain and simple fact.
(including that because the only thing the comment proves is June has learned how to use the Windows-Macintosh cut and paste functions)

*****

Jim Coulthard! Where are you? You're going to have to step up! As these comments prove, you have a lot more competition than you had this summer! You are not allowed to rest easy on your Wie Warrior Mensa laurels!



So Lisa, tell me WHY I'm supposed to think the Wie Warriors aren't dumb?

-George

Norman:

** For Wie to enter an amatuer tournament instead of a womens major would be absolutely ridiculous. **

A bit of a weak effort, even for you, Norman.

I already stipulated there's no proof. I stated B.J. crafted an excellent cover story. Of course, the majors, including the Major won by Paula Creamer, are prestigious, and it is entirely reasonable for Wie to skip the amateur event for the majors.

There is NO WAY TO PROVE that Michelle ducked competing against Morgan.

IT IS A FACT, HOWEVER, that a loss in the Women's Amateur, especially to the eventual champ, Pressel, would have greatly dimmed the Wie mystique.

And that would have happened a mere two months before Wie went pro.

So I wasn't proved wrong, Norman, certainly not by you.

Ducking Morgan Pressel, however DOES fit the pattern of creating and preserving mystique around Michelle Wie. Wie was not expected to win the major that Creamer won nor the major that Jang won. Wie WOULD have been expected to win the Women's Amateur.

Therefore, the script carefully fashioned by B.J. Wie served to preserve the mystique and help ensure Michelle landed the $20 million payday.

That is absolutely fine and should be applauded. There is no problem with that. One simply has to recognize WHY Mr. Wie chose those events for his daughter. And the script included avoiding any face-off against Morgan Pressel.

-George

George,
Before Michelle Wie played the British Open she had played 6 lpga events that year.
Her results were:
2nd, 2nd, 2nd, 12th, 14th, 23rd.

With 3 2nd places in just 6 events, it would be reasonable for her to assume, that she might be competitive at the British Open.

As it turned out, she was very competitive and finished 3rd at the British Open.

If Morgan Pressel had been offered the opportunity to play at the British Open, she would have been there too. Do you deny that?

George,

I've never seen such a twisted argument. You admit that it made sense to Wie to play the British Open rather than the amatuer. Yet, you still argue that she did it to duck playing Pressel because there is no proof that she didn't want to duck playing Pressel. Such a thing isn't provable. You are clearly grasping at straws.

Matt. I listed Wie's qualifying records because you said wie was handed everything and earn nothing.
Now AJGA grandslam and winning women's Amateur is nice achievement but we are talking about achievement which deserves "hype". Morgan was 2nd player to achieve AJGA grandslam. First player was kelly Booth. Kelly Booth couldn't even made it to final stage of Q school this year and probably wiil never make it to LPGA. That shows AJGA grandslam doesn't mean much when it comes to future success.
Same thing goes to Winning women's amateur. Vicki Goetche won 2 women's amateur. She won First title at age 16 and won second by beating none other than Annika at final. At that time people thought Goetche, not Annika was future big thing. Goetche is still looking for her first win.
Pressel earned hype by becoming youngest player to qualify for women's open and by finishing 2nd in women's open. Neither has anything to do with "winning". If you really believe pressel earned hype by winning amateur tournaments, you are misguided.

george,

I see where you're coming from, maybe Wie did try to avoid facing Pressel (minding the fact that, as i recall, with the exception of the 2005 US Open, she has placed higher than Pressel in other pro events), but then again maybe she didn't. In all seriousness, if you or anyone (including morgan pressel) were given a chance to play in france and britain against the best players in the world all the while enjoying the areas,you would be completely out of your mind to reject that and play in georgia.

It's just common sense.

George--

Michelle Wie decides to play against professional women, and professional men and she's a coward??

Call me crazy but I respect anyone who plays UP to the competion and not down.
Since when is playing against tougher competition ducking competition. That is twisted thinking...

Half the people Pressel beat at Q-school are probably working part time at Bennigans right now...

Hmmm-what's more impressive finishing ahead of Annika Sorenstam twice, (as Michelle did twice this summer) or finishing ahead of some random girl that probably just got her braces...

Why is the argument concerning mental toughness alwasys skewed against Michelle Wie ?

It can be argued that all this adversity and close calls is actually good for Michelle because it will end up toughening her up in the long run.

It can also be argued that because Morgan Pressel had such an easy time winning in the junior and amateur ranks that she doesn't know how to deal with tougher competition and will struggle once she experiences some adversity on the golf course.
Its possible that things came so easy for her in the beginning that when the going gets tough she doesn't know how to take it.

After all it was Morgan Pressel and not Michelle Wie who broke down crying uncontrollably after the first round of the US Women's Open when she played the last few holes badly.
I can understand the crying after the tournament since she was so close to winning but the first round ??
That's not a sign of a mentally tough person to me.

Jack. Did you see names who finished ahead Morgan at Q school? You know Ai Miyazato destroyed field and Morgan. But look at these names who finished ahead Morgan at Q school. Libby Smith, Lee Ann Walker-Cooper, Brooke Tull, Katie Futcher. Maybe Even players who beat Pressel at Q school are working part time at bannigans.

Matt. there is reason why wie supporters feel Anti wie camp have hiden agenda. They rip wie based on false facts. At least you were honest enough to reveal you are close to Pressel family. But a lot of your claims are based on false facts or perception.

I already showed Wie earned hype by setting a lot of qualifying records. Also it might surprise you that wie got into LPGA tourney by monday qualfier twice while both pressel and Creamer( in other words, players who supposedly earned everything) never attempted monday qualifier.

you said Wies disrespected junior competition. Absolute false. I followed wie since she was 12 and none of wie family made comments disrespectful to fellow competitors or AJGA. Matter of Fact, BJ wie even said there is no guarantee michelle would win AJGA tourney because girls are so good. In reality, AJGA field is pretty weak. I think Morgan won betsy rawls championship, one of AJGA major. Runner up of that tournament was Esther choe and She finished something like 15 or 16 strokes behind wie after 2nd round of women's open. Wies could show how weak AJGA field and explain why They don't need to play in ajga but they didn't choose that way because they didn't want to be disrespectful to fellow junior competitors.
I can guarantee you won't find single comment from wies who showed disrepct to fellow competitor or junior competition.

When Michelle competes in and qualifies for the LPGA Tour through the grueling Q-School process you can comment on Pressels performance. Right now, however it is just another thing that Morgan has accomplished and Wie has not(yet). Jay--as for those women you suggested work as waitreses they are actually quite accomplished. Katie Fulcher is a two-time NCAA all american, Brooke Tull was also an All-American and member of the futures tour, Lee Ann Walker-Cooper and Libby Smith were both already LPGA touring pros when they achived their exempt status and in an ironic note Libby Smith is the only women in history to play for a men's division I college golf team(University of Vermont and she was Captain to boot). Not bad for a bennigan's staff.

If pressel simply stated her goal is earning card and winning isn't her priority, then Pressel's finish position wouldn't have mattered much because finishing first or finishing 6th produced same result. But because pressel declaired her goal is winning, not just earning card, now people can jump on pressel's performance because she finshed way way behind leader and finished behind no name( in relative terms) players.

The proof is in the result. Miss Wie finished ahead of Miss Creamer more times in 2005 when they played in the same event.

Miss Wie finished ahead of many seasoned male professional golfers in the Men's Events she entered.

Why would anyone consider playing in an amature event when you can play in the Women's British Open? A note here; Miss Wie finished ahead of some of the finest women professional golfers in the world

I'm not a Michelle groupie, yet I can see talent when it is displayed and aprreciate it.

You tell 'em RRR! What a lot of these Wie haters don't realize is that Michelle only missed the cut at this year's Sony by a measly seven strokes! Why, that's not even half a stroke per hole! If she progresses just like Norman says, driving another 30 yards, improving her long irons and her short game, and doing better with her putting, there is no reason why she can't get back to her stellar game of missing the cut by only one or two shots. I can't wait for the disappointment the Wie doubters will experience when Michelle finally makes a cut in a men's event and gets on the cover of Sports' Illustrated, is named Time's Person of the Year, and is canonized by the Vatican all in one week. Making the cut looks good this year. I hear that she got a sponsor's exemption in the Bessarabian Gypsy Invitational.

John Zelda, from your last comments, I am having difficulty deciding if you said your age was 7, or was it 5?

It is very easy to distort things to suit your argument.

I never said MW needed to add 30 yards to her game. She needs to add 10-15 yards to be able to compete at the very top. Her putting needs to improve to compete at the top.

At this moment, if she just putted slightly better, she would make a cut easy, that is not alot of improvement needed.
The length is something she could do with to help her game, but she can easily make cuts without adding a single yard to her length.

The whole difficulty here is that you are saying it is impossible for her to compete because she is a woman. The point is, if her putting was better, she would have already made a mens cut with several shots to spare. You don't need strength to putt.

As regards the 7 stroke missed cut, that was in hugely windy conditions. If you know anything about golf (something I seriously doubt), you will know that young players very seldom do well in wind.
As regards getting back to just missing by a stroke or two, she did that at the John Deere Classic a few months after the Sony. Perhaps you were having a nap then.

Norman, maybe Ken can explain how Herb Krickstein got his right-wing wind machine on to the course at the Sony. I tell ya, these Wie haters will stop at nothing!

In this year's Sony there were very windy conditions for Michelle Wie which were worse than those faced by some of the other players.

Herb Krickstein's politics and religion have nothing to do with this--but I have a suspicion that the biggest problem with Morgan Pressel might well be Herb Krickstein.

There is a very simple answer to Herb Krickstein's campaign. If he thinks Morgan Pressel should be treated as an adult now, then he should shut up and let her speak for herself.

I think Michelle Wie is a a good golfer and admit it whoever is against her is a looser.

If people are questioning how well Wie has done in her attempts at qualifying for the pga I would suggest they compare her results against Tigers.
Bearing in mind she was 13-15 years old and Tiger was 18-20. It makes very interesting reading.
I do feel however that the Wie bashers are not really interested in actual facts.
Alan M

Matt,

Sorry I took so long to reply to your reply to my challenge about disparaging remarks by the Wies.