May
05
Eight times is the charm: Michelle Wie makes the cut in a men's event
Currently tied at seventeenth place, Michelle Wie has made history once again, becoming the youngest female to make the cut in a men?s event?the Asian Tour?s SK Telecom Open.
The high school junior certainly isn’t the first woman to play against the boys. We all know about Annika Sorenstam?s bid at the Bank of America Colonial in 2003, where four strokes kept her from making the cut. But you may not know that big hitter Laura Davies of England, with 20 LPGA wins (four of which were majors) tried her hand at the Korean Open on the Asian Tour in 2003, but missed the cut by four strokes. Also in 2003, Sweden?s six-time LPGA winner Sophie Gustafson played in the Casio World Open in Japan, but failed to make the cut. And most recently, Ai Miyazato, with 12 international victories, played in the Okinawa Open on Japan?s JGTO Tour in 2005, but missed the cut.
Four-time LPGA champion Se Ri Pak has had the most success?in 2003 she placed tenth at the SBS Super Tournament, an event on the Korean Tour. By Sunday, we?ll know whether Michelle can top that performance.
Meanwhile, Tim McDonald thinks she should forget about her dreams to ?challenge the men,? that she?s merely setting herself up for disappointment. Remind me not to have Tim babysit my daughter. See, I like the fact that Michelle dreams big. I can?t fathom anyone telling her, my daughter, or anyone else, otherwise.
Six years ago I hadn?t picked up a golf club, and I certainly never thought I?d ever be shooting in the low 80?s, which I did just yesterday. One year ago I dreamed of writing a book. It?s coming out July 11.
Had I listened to McDonald, or anyone like him, I would?ve declared both goals Mission: Impossible and given up long ago, unwilling to set myself up for disappointment. But I prefer to follow Michelle Wie?s example.
Keep going, Michelle. As Teddy Roosevelt once said, credit goes to the one who ?knows the great enthusiasm, the great devotion, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement and who at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly.?
The only way Michelle will end up disappointed will be if she looks back ten, twenty, or thirty years from now and realizes she didn?t dream big enough.
| « Annika Sorenstam misses a cut: what is the world coming to? | Five Burning Questions about the 2006 Masters » |
90 comments
Comment from: Mike [Visitor]
I believe if she finishes 17th place or higher, Wie will be the first woman to receive men's world ranking points.
05/05/06 @ 12:50
Comment from: putt4par [Visitor]
Thank you Jennifer.
We have schools full of people like Tim and Alex. They often call them selves guidance counselors.
One such person told my youngest sister that learning latin was foolish, she would never ever get into B.Sc program nor ever become a Veternarian. Thank god she didn't listen to that fool. She had 11 successful years as a large animal vet before she succumbed to the ravages of breast cnacer.
My oldest sister was told by the same guidance counselor that she should forget about calculas, she just wasn't smart enough to handle that kind of higher math. Again, a B.Sc and and M.Sc later she is doing very well thank you.
My brother was steered to a school for trades. He became a tradesman but decided to follow his dream and now holds a Phd in philosophy.
Each of those kids could have believed the negative idiots, the dream stealers. That is what is so sad about Tim. I hope he is sterile. No child deserves to have a parent like him.
Can you see where this is going, Jennifer? You just keep telling your children, male and female to dare to dream big and for god's sake keep the Tim Mcdonalds of the world and their dream stealing butts out of your house.
We won't even bother to discuss Tims buddy Chris or the naysayer that always yaps at their heels, Mr. Alex.
I hope Alexdaughters and daughters-in-law keep him ot of their families lives, for the sake of the grandchildrens dreams.
We have schools full of people like Tim and Alex. They often call them selves guidance counselors.
One such person told my youngest sister that learning latin was foolish, she would never ever get into B.Sc program nor ever become a Veternarian. Thank god she didn't listen to that fool. She had 11 successful years as a large animal vet before she succumbed to the ravages of breast cnacer.
My oldest sister was told by the same guidance counselor that she should forget about calculas, she just wasn't smart enough to handle that kind of higher math. Again, a B.Sc and and M.Sc later she is doing very well thank you.
My brother was steered to a school for trades. He became a tradesman but decided to follow his dream and now holds a Phd in philosophy.
Each of those kids could have believed the negative idiots, the dream stealers. That is what is so sad about Tim. I hope he is sterile. No child deserves to have a parent like him.
Can you see where this is going, Jennifer? You just keep telling your children, male and female to dare to dream big and for god's sake keep the Tim Mcdonalds of the world and their dream stealing butts out of your house.
We won't even bother to discuss Tims buddy Chris or the naysayer that always yaps at their heels, Mr. Alex.
I hope Alexdaughters and daughters-in-law keep him ot of their families lives, for the sake of the grandchildrens dreams.
05/05/06 @ 13:05
Comment from: ToddCommish [Visitor]
I figured I'd come to Wie's biggest fan to give props. Hey, it's the minor leagues (AA level), but it's a cut. Hold off on the champagne and trumpets though. This is more the equivalent of Manon Rheaume playing minor league hockey or Ann Meyers playing summer league basketball than Babe Didrickson making the cut at a PGA event.
05/05/06 @ 13:13
Comment from: Candace Polski [Visitor]
I think you go a little far in your comparisons Todd, but you are correct that this is a far cry from making the PGA cut. However, it was notable that Michelle was able to compete in the men's amateur championship, age not withstanding, so it is certainly noteworthy that she makes a cut against pro men.
Look at her own reaction - she was not jumping for joy or shouting from the mountaintop. She said she was pleased, gave a little wave, and talked of more work to do.
I know how many naysayers love to point out that Wie "apologists" always talk about how young she is, but it can't be overplayed, frankly. She is a pro in name but not in age or schedule. At 16, with her lack of focus on golf (compared to a full time pro), making a cut in a men's pro tournament at any level is impressive. For Michelle, it's ho-hum, and rightly so. She will go on to do more impressive things, and probably in this calendar year.
(By the way, nice looking book Jen! Put me down for a copy...can I get it signed?)
Look at her own reaction - she was not jumping for joy or shouting from the mountaintop. She said she was pleased, gave a little wave, and talked of more work to do.
I know how many naysayers love to point out that Wie "apologists" always talk about how young she is, but it can't be overplayed, frankly. She is a pro in name but not in age or schedule. At 16, with her lack of focus on golf (compared to a full time pro), making a cut in a men's pro tournament at any level is impressive. For Michelle, it's ho-hum, and rightly so. She will go on to do more impressive things, and probably in this calendar year.
(By the way, nice looking book Jen! Put me down for a copy...can I get it signed?)
05/05/06 @ 13:29
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
Jennifer,
Very good article, there is just one point I would take issue with:
***********************************
Four-time LPGA champion Se Ri Pak has had the most success?in 2003 she placed tenth at the SBS Super Tournament, an event on the Korean Tour. By Sunday, we?ll know whether Michelle can top that performance.
***********************************
As you said in that quote, Se Ri Pak was 10th on the Korean Tour.
The mistake is when you ask whether Michelle can top that performance.
By making the cut on the Asian Tour, Michelle has already far exceeded the performance of 10th on the Korean Tour.
Comparing Se Ri Pak's to Michelle's tournament is like saying someone who makes a cut on the Nationwide Tour is the same as someone who makes the cut on the PGA Tour.
The only similarity between the Nationwide and PGA tours are they are both in America.
The only similarity between Michelle and Se Ri Pak's events is that they were both held in Korea.
To illustrate further, Se Ri Pak received no ranking points for her 10th place finish.
If Michelle places in the top 17, she will get Official World Golf Ranking points, and she would be the first woman to do this.
Very good article, there is just one point I would take issue with:
***********************************
Four-time LPGA champion Se Ri Pak has had the most success?in 2003 she placed tenth at the SBS Super Tournament, an event on the Korean Tour. By Sunday, we?ll know whether Michelle can top that performance.
***********************************
As you said in that quote, Se Ri Pak was 10th on the Korean Tour.
The mistake is when you ask whether Michelle can top that performance.
By making the cut on the Asian Tour, Michelle has already far exceeded the performance of 10th on the Korean Tour.
Comparing Se Ri Pak's to Michelle's tournament is like saying someone who makes a cut on the Nationwide Tour is the same as someone who makes the cut on the PGA Tour.
The only similarity between the Nationwide and PGA tours are they are both in America.
The only similarity between Michelle and Se Ri Pak's events is that they were both held in Korea.
To illustrate further, Se Ri Pak received no ranking points for her 10th place finish.
If Michelle places in the top 17, she will get Official World Golf Ranking points, and she would be the first woman to do this.
05/05/06 @ 13:30
Comment from: Candace Polski [Visitor]
Good to hear from you John D! And here I was thinking misogyny and xenophobia were dead!
05/05/06 @ 13:33
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
Comment from: John D [Visitor]
Maybe she found her niche....STAY IN KOREA !!!!
Racist!!!!!
Maybe she found her niche....STAY IN KOREA !!!!
Racist!!!!!
05/05/06 @ 14:07
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
Norman I believe Michelle has a different outlook on what she wants to do over the next couple of days. She will be figuring out a way to finish in the top 10. That would eclipse Babe's record and solidify her place in history.
I see this as a breakout moment for Michelle that will give her the confidence to close out a field on the LPGA tour and make a PGA cut this year.
Ledbetter has done a good job with Michelle on her course management skills that are evident in her last few events.
I see this as a breakout moment for Michelle that will give her the confidence to close out a field on the LPGA tour and make a PGA cut this year.
Ledbetter has done a good job with Michelle on her course management skills that are evident in her last few events.
05/05/06 @ 14:22
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
One-putt, if she gets that top 17, she will definetely have done something no other woman has done before, in getting on the Official Rankings Lists.
As regards the top 10, I think if she does that, there are plenty of people around who will claim that it means nothing. We both know they are wrong, but she will need to get that pga cut to join Babe's particular achievement.
I agree with you completely that this success should give her alot of confidence.
When she starts her next pga event, she will know that she has made a cut already in a mens event.
If she hadn't, then the newspaper's would have read, Wie has her 9th attempt having missed the previous 8 cuts. Now they can't print that headline.
She has made a cut against the men, and although the pga is more difficult, she has alot less pressure going into those events.
I agree with you, that both an lpga win and a pga cut are not that far away.
I think she has a great chance this year of an lpga win.
As regards the top 10, I think if she does that, there are plenty of people around who will claim that it means nothing. We both know they are wrong, but she will need to get that pga cut to join Babe's particular achievement.
I agree with you completely that this success should give her alot of confidence.
When she starts her next pga event, she will know that she has made a cut already in a mens event.
If she hadn't, then the newspaper's would have read, Wie has her 9th attempt having missed the previous 8 cuts. Now they can't print that headline.
She has made a cut against the men, and although the pga is more difficult, she has alot less pressure going into those events.
I agree with you, that both an lpga win and a pga cut are not that far away.
I think she has a great chance this year of an lpga win.
05/05/06 @ 14:34
Comment from: hc2 [Visitor]
If you guys check into the USGA website, you will see that Michelle entered the US Women's open; and will have to qualify for the sectionals. She was given a local exemption. I assume this was because of schedule conflict with her trying to qualify for the Men's Women's Open.
You heard it from me first. So, the USGA decided to thread the needle by not giving her the entire exemption; but sort of halfway. It seems the critics of Michelle's exemptions are starting to be heard.
You heard it from me first. So, the USGA decided to thread the needle by not giving her the entire exemption; but sort of halfway. It seems the critics of Michelle's exemptions are starting to be heard.
05/05/06 @ 18:33
Comment from: James COULTHARD [Visitor]
Michelle Wie has earned her local exemption from qualifying for the US Women's Open. The USGA has said she would be given a special exemption if she performs well enough on the LPGA to have earned a Top 35 exemption had she been an LPGA member. Two years ago she was given such an exemption based upon the money she would have earned as an amateur. The time frame for the Top 35 exemption runs through the end of May. At that time Wie will almost certainly have earned more than the #35 LPGA member and will presumeably be given her special exemption.
05/05/06 @ 19:18
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
hc2,
Don't worry about her entry to the US Open qualifying.
It is simply a normal step, just in case she doesn't get an exemption.
Wouldn't she look silly if by chance she didn't enter qualifying and then she didn't get an exemption.
As Jim said, she will be given an exemption, because the man in charge has said she would if she was in the top 35 of the money list at that time, and she will be.
The exemptions simply haven't been given out yet.
Don't worry about her entry to the US Open qualifying.
It is simply a normal step, just in case she doesn't get an exemption.
Wouldn't she look silly if by chance she didn't enter qualifying and then she didn't get an exemption.
As Jim said, she will be given an exemption, because the man in charge has said she would if she was in the top 35 of the money list at that time, and she will be.
The exemptions simply haven't been given out yet.
05/05/06 @ 20:07
Stop the Press! Jennifer, maybe you can still put this chapter (making the cut) in the book as an addendum.
05/05/06 @ 22:04
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Oh Riffle-snortz. The leaderboard stopped advancing with about 30 players on the course. Incheon Airport reporting heavy rain. Predicted to continue all day. Hope the Korean weathermen prove as reliable as their American counterparts and it clears enough to get the round in.
Forecast for tomorrow is sunny. This may end up being a 54 hole event.
Ah me, I must be off to sleepy-land.
Forecast for tomorrow is sunny. This may end up being a 54 hole event.
Ah me, I must be off to sleepy-land.
05/05/06 @ 23:24
Comment from: jueken [Visitor]
While America sleeps, the 3rd round has been cancelled and the tournament officially shortened to 54 holes.(http://www.asiantour.com/)
05/06/06 @ 02:27
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
"Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
hc2,
Don't worry about her entry to the US Open qualifying.
It is simply a normal step, just in case she doesn't get an exemption.
Wouldn't she look silly if by chance she didn't enter qualifying and then she didn't get an exemption.
As Jim said, she will be given an exemption, because the man in charge has said she would if she was in the top 35 of the money list at that time, and she will be.
The exemptions simply haven't been given out yet."
Based on the paychecks Michelle has cashed from only two events, she stands in 14th place on the ADT money list (if the biddies counted her winnings).
The USAG will not keep the first girl to make a professional men's PGA tournament cut in 61 years out of the Women's US Open.
They would be "stuck on stupid" like the Wie Haters if they did that.
hc2,
Don't worry about her entry to the US Open qualifying.
It is simply a normal step, just in case she doesn't get an exemption.
Wouldn't she look silly if by chance she didn't enter qualifying and then she didn't get an exemption.
As Jim said, she will be given an exemption, because the man in charge has said she would if she was in the top 35 of the money list at that time, and she will be.
The exemptions simply haven't been given out yet."
Based on the paychecks Michelle has cashed from only two events, she stands in 14th place on the ADT money list (if the biddies counted her winnings).
The USAG will not keep the first girl to make a professional men's PGA tournament cut in 61 years out of the Women's US Open.
They would be "stuck on stupid" like the Wie Haters if they did that.
05/06/06 @ 04:16
Comment from: jon [Visitor]
Congrats on your book, Jen. Who is the target audience? Adults, young adults, parents, all of the above. I am not big on biographies of teenagers, but if it includes a detailed section on her swing and what separates her from others, I may just buy one. God knows I have too many golf books.
05/06/06 @ 07:47
Congratulations on your book, and great writing here. I enjoyed it. Do you and Chris Baldwin get along?
05/06/06 @ 13:36
Comment from: Joe Cool [Visitor]
I found it interesting that Dottie Pepper downplayed Michelle's "making the cut" as "no big deal." Pepper stated that there really wasn't any competition at the SK Telecom Tournament. She used the world rankings as her argument in order to belittle Michelle's accomplishment. Latest rumor has Dottie getting married to Baldwin...wow, what a couple that will be!! Pepper Girl will not dare challenge MW to a match since she would not like to be outdriven 60 yards from the tee.
05/06/06 @ 14:02
Comment from: Jay [Visitor]
Not only Dottie Pepper, apparently, there are some Korean version of Chris Baldwin.
I read a news that some Koreans argued that Wie's making cut at SK was no big deal because the course was not "Man" enough. (ie, not so long and tough to separate a boy from men, er, girl from men)
I read a news that some Koreans argued that Wie's making cut at SK was no big deal because the course was not "Man" enough. (ie, not so long and tough to separate a boy from men, er, girl from men)
05/06/06 @ 14:43
Comment from: JR [Visitor]
One-Putt: you stated... "The USAG will not keep the first girl to make a professional men's PGA tournament cut in 61 years out of the Women's US Open." Didn't Se Ri Pak make a cut in a KPGA event in 2003???? It is a men's professional golf tour. Doesn't this count????? Was this an inadvertant omission or are you trying to make Ms Wie sound more credible?????
05/06/06 @ 15:06
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
JR,
The Korean Tour that Se Ri Pak made a cut on is not a credible tour. Had Se Ri Pak won the event, she would have got no official world golf ranking points.
If Michelle Wie has a top 17 placing in this event, she will get official world golf ranking points and she would be the first woman ever to get official world golf ranking points.
The big difference is Se Ri Pak's event was on the Korean Tour, which is not a major tour. Michelle's event was on the Asian Tour which is one of the 6 major tours.
They are: pga tour, euro tour, asian tour, japanese tour, sunshine tour and australian tour.
The Korean Tour that Se Ri Pak made a cut on is not a credible tour. Had Se Ri Pak won the event, she would have got no official world golf ranking points.
If Michelle Wie has a top 17 placing in this event, she will get official world golf ranking points and she would be the first woman ever to get official world golf ranking points.
The big difference is Se Ri Pak's event was on the Korean Tour, which is not a major tour. Michelle's event was on the Asian Tour which is one of the 6 major tours.
They are: pga tour, euro tour, asian tour, japanese tour, sunshine tour and australian tour.
05/06/06 @ 16:21
Check this out: an article by Rishi Narain, a former Asian Games gold medallist.
Wie-ing for equal honours
Wie-ing for equal honours
05/06/06 @ 18:01
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
"Comment from: JR [Visitor]
One-Putt: you stated... "The USAG will not keep the first girl to make a professional men's PGA tournament cut in 61 years out of the Women's US Open." Didn't Se Ri Pak make a cut in a KPGA event in 2003???? It is a men's professional golf tour. Doesn't this count????? Was this an inadvertant omission or are you trying to make Ms Wie sound more credible?????"
Time for a Tour education for JR and the rest who doubt the significance of Michelle's achievement.
The leading Men's Tours in the world are associated with the PGA and the players receive points in the World Golf Rankings based on how they finish. The Asian Tour that "sanctioned" the SK Open is one of these tours. The event Ms. Pak entered and finished 10th in the field was not an Asian Tour event and simply was a "Local" Korean Professional match. You might ask yourself why Ms. Pak did not play in any more men's events after finishing in 10th place.
The USA had many nonsanctioned Professional events in the past until the PGA and LPGA created the Nationwide and Futures tours respectively. This gave them (PGA/LPGA) nearly absolute control and a monopoly on professional golf matches.
Ms. Pak played against mostly local Scrubs who could not hold an Asian Tour card and Michelle is playing against some of the top Asian Tour members long with a PGA Tour member K.J. Choi.
Did I leave anything out Norman?
One-Putt: you stated... "The USAG will not keep the first girl to make a professional men's PGA tournament cut in 61 years out of the Women's US Open." Didn't Se Ri Pak make a cut in a KPGA event in 2003???? It is a men's professional golf tour. Doesn't this count????? Was this an inadvertant omission or are you trying to make Ms Wie sound more credible?????"
Time for a Tour education for JR and the rest who doubt the significance of Michelle's achievement.
The leading Men's Tours in the world are associated with the PGA and the players receive points in the World Golf Rankings based on how they finish. The Asian Tour that "sanctioned" the SK Open is one of these tours. The event Ms. Pak entered and finished 10th in the field was not an Asian Tour event and simply was a "Local" Korean Professional match. You might ask yourself why Ms. Pak did not play in any more men's events after finishing in 10th place.
The USA had many nonsanctioned Professional events in the past until the PGA and LPGA created the Nationwide and Futures tours respectively. This gave them (PGA/LPGA) nearly absolute control and a monopoly on professional golf matches.
Ms. Pak played against mostly local Scrubs who could not hold an Asian Tour card and Michelle is playing against some of the top Asian Tour members long with a PGA Tour member K.J. Choi.
Did I leave anything out Norman?
05/06/06 @ 19:19
Comment from: putt4par [Visitor]
You done good, One-putt.
I have placed an order for your book, Jen. Amazon says it'll be shipped on July 11, 2006. Now let us know where we can get it signed.
Patrick, with your pictures and Jen writing the book, I am sure it will be successful. Very good article here.
"Don't let anyone steal your dream" should be a daily mantra for everyone. It would go a long way to shutting down guys like Baldwin.
I have placed an order for your book, Jen. Amazon says it'll be shipped on July 11, 2006. Now let us know where we can get it signed.
Patrick, with your pictures and Jen writing the book, I am sure it will be successful. Very good article here.
"Don't let anyone steal your dream" should be a daily mantra for everyone. It would go a long way to shutting down guys like Baldwin.
05/06/06 @ 19:31
Brian, $1,000,000 (or $700,000?) appearance fee for popular Michelle Wie compared to a paltry sum of $200,000 for 3-time PGA Tour winner and defending champion KJ Choi.
Choi did take it like a man, but he put his foot down when it came to being grouped with the wunderkind. Michelle could add insult to injury though if she keeps her one stroke lead over Choi. I hope she does, the nerve of that guy. (lol)
Choi did take it like a man, but he put his foot down when it came to being grouped with the wunderkind. Michelle could add insult to injury though if she keeps her one stroke lead over Choi. I hope she does, the nerve of that guy. (lol)
05/06/06 @ 22:43
Comment from: hc2 [Visitor]
I really don't understand what the Golf
Channel is doing. They must have asked Dottie Pepper like a hundred times about Michelle Wie's progress or lack of; and her answer is like a tape recorder since she keeps saying the same thing: stick to women's juniors/amateurs. That is just dumb; we all know what she is gonna say; so why ask? I also wonder why they ask her about Michelle's progress since she has no clue what it takes to make in the men's tours. It's like asking a motorcycle mechanic to give you advice on how to fix a car. If you are going to ask anyone, ask someone who is experienced with the men's game.
Channel is doing. They must have asked Dottie Pepper like a hundred times about Michelle Wie's progress or lack of; and her answer is like a tape recorder since she keeps saying the same thing: stick to women's juniors/amateurs. That is just dumb; we all know what she is gonna say; so why ask? I also wonder why they ask her about Michelle's progress since she has no clue what it takes to make in the men's tours. It's like asking a motorcycle mechanic to give you advice on how to fix a car. If you are going to ask anyone, ask someone who is experienced with the men's game.
05/07/06 @ 00:11
Comment from: Candace Polski [Visitor]
Looks like Wie stumbled on the back nine of the final round, so will only end up with a middle of the pack showing. She didn't get the rest of the work done. Too bad, she had posted some solid scores the first two rounds. Still, a nice next step for her - this will only increase her confidence in competing with men. It will be interesting to see how she does in the Men's US Open qualifiers later this month.
05/07/06 @ 02:58
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
Michelle's appearance fee was $750,000 with $50,000 going for airfares for her family, staff, security and accomodations.
05/07/06 @ 04:30
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
The wind and soggy course conditions stacked the odds against Michelle today. Her GIR dropped to 66.66 percent and her putting rose for GIR to 1.92 with a on green average putting of 1.72 overall.
05/07/06 @ 05:08
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
"Comment from: hc2 [Visitor]
I really don't understand what the Golf
Channel is doing. They must have asked Dottie Pepper like a hundred times about Michelle Wie's progress or lack of; and her answer is like a tape recorder since she keeps saying the same thing: stick to women's juniors/amateurs. That is just dumb; we all know what she is gonna say; so why ask? I also wonder why they ask her about Michelle's progress since she has no clue what it takes to make in the men's tours. It's like asking a motorcycle mechanic to give you advice on how to fix a car. If you are going to ask anyone, ask someone who is experienced with the men's game.
Dottie is one of the "Old Biddies" I was referring to. She joined the LPGA tour before Michelle was born. Nancy and she would do and say anything to maintain the integrity of the LPGA tour and their old age pensions.
I really don't understand what the Golf
Channel is doing. They must have asked Dottie Pepper like a hundred times about Michelle Wie's progress or lack of; and her answer is like a tape recorder since she keeps saying the same thing: stick to women's juniors/amateurs. That is just dumb; we all know what she is gonna say; so why ask? I also wonder why they ask her about Michelle's progress since she has no clue what it takes to make in the men's tours. It's like asking a motorcycle mechanic to give you advice on how to fix a car. If you are going to ask anyone, ask someone who is experienced with the men's game.
Dottie is one of the "Old Biddies" I was referring to. She joined the LPGA tour before Michelle was born. Nancy and she would do and say anything to maintain the integrity of the LPGA tour and their old age pensions.
05/07/06 @ 05:45
Comment from: Jon [Visitor]
1)I think Michelle's problem is not her golf game but her teenage head. I was surprised how fast she has remedied her putting problems. Sergio still hasn't solved his putting problem. After two solid rounds, she probably got ahead of herself. Perhaps,'let me win this tourney.' She had a great final round start, going -2 after a few holes, then the teeenage head took over--- youthful exuberance followed by teenage panick. Not too helpful in a golf tournament. Still a great and historical result, whiile leaving some meat for both her supporters and critics alike. 2) Economics of the SK Open: An article stated that the SK Open is projected to make a profit, even after the appearance fees. While other events there are perenial momey losers, SK recouped the appearance fees by selling the TV coverage to a local network, and they expect to make money on ticket sales. This I think is the most significant aspect of the tournment, besides Wie's obvious accomplishment. 3) LPGA course set up: Even the LPA majors don't really set up for MIchelle's game. They are too short and penalizes Wie too much. A great golf course set up doesn't penalize either the short hitters or long bombers, They leave a way for them to play their games, short hitters going for narrow, precision shots, while long bombers attempting to fly over potential disasters. This makes it a more of thinking, strategic game and more fun to watch, displaying variety of different shots and course managements. The LPGA should stop bitching about Wie playing on other tours. If they are serious and sincere about her playing LPGA exclusively (cough, cough), well, then do something about it. Make the set up better, and give more exemption when asked. The LPGA risks killing the Goose that laid the golden eggs. --- Another asinine comment about 'not changing rules for individuals." well, wake up and smell the coffee. The rules are broken and changed all the time when it no longer serves the purpose. Even Pinchem changed the rule about caddies not wearing shorts, when Tiger objected to the supidity of the rule and threatened to play in the European Tour. Have a nice weekend. LOL
05/07/06 @ 07:20
Comment from: hc2 [Visitor]
When I watched the Women's Amateur last year, I sensed it was over hyped, and there was an air of snootiness by the Golf Channel commentaries (Cockerill, Pearl Sinn, Pepper, Lopez), most of them former winners of that championship. So many former winners have gone on to become mediocre/average players in the lpga: Becky Lucidy, Virada Nirapathpongporn, Jane Park, Jill McGill, Kelly Kuehne, Meredith Duncan, Pearl Sinn, etc. All these players basically have struggled/area struglling to make a living in the LPGA, in spite of their impressive amateur resume. In the case of Lucidy she is still in the Futures tour.
Yet, when you watch the Women's Amateur on tv, and how the commentaries (Cockerill, Pepper, McGill, etc) talk about it, they make it sound like winning it would surely lead to hall of fame type of success.
That couldn'be further from the truth. Sorenstam, Webb, Se Ri Pak didn't win it yet they are hall of famers. Even Ochoa didn't win it and she will be a hall of famer for sure.
--
US Women's Amateur champs since 1970:
1970 Martha Wilkinson
1971 Laura Baugh
1972 Mary Ann Budke
1973 Carol Semple
1974 Cynthia Hill
1975 Beth Daniel
1976 Donna Horton
1977 Beth Daniel
1978 Cathy Sherk
1979 Carolyn Hill
1980?82 Juli Inkster
1983 Joanne Pacillo
1984 Deb Richard
1985 Michiko Hattori
1986 Kay Cockerill
1987 Kay Cockerill
1988 Pearl Sinn
1989 Vicki Goetze
1990 Pat Hurst
1991 Amy Fruhwirth
1992 Vicki Goetze
1993 Jill McGill
1994 Wendy Ward
1995?96 Kelli Kuehne
1997 Silvia Cavalleri
1998 Grace Park
1999 Dorothy Delasin
2000 Marcy Newton
2001 Meredith Duncan
2002 Becky Lucidi
2003 Virada Nirapathpongporn
2004 Jane Park
2005 Morgan Pressel
Yet, when you watch the Women's Amateur on tv, and how the commentaries (Cockerill, Pepper, McGill, etc) talk about it, they make it sound like winning it would surely lead to hall of fame type of success.
That couldn'be further from the truth. Sorenstam, Webb, Se Ri Pak didn't win it yet they are hall of famers. Even Ochoa didn't win it and she will be a hall of famer for sure.
--
US Women's Amateur champs since 1970:
1970 Martha Wilkinson
1971 Laura Baugh
1972 Mary Ann Budke
1973 Carol Semple
1974 Cynthia Hill
1975 Beth Daniel
1976 Donna Horton
1977 Beth Daniel
1978 Cathy Sherk
1979 Carolyn Hill
1980?82 Juli Inkster
1983 Joanne Pacillo
1984 Deb Richard
1985 Michiko Hattori
1986 Kay Cockerill
1987 Kay Cockerill
1988 Pearl Sinn
1989 Vicki Goetze
1990 Pat Hurst
1991 Amy Fruhwirth
1992 Vicki Goetze
1993 Jill McGill
1994 Wendy Ward
1995?96 Kelli Kuehne
1997 Silvia Cavalleri
1998 Grace Park
1999 Dorothy Delasin
2000 Marcy Newton
2001 Meredith Duncan
2002 Becky Lucidi
2003 Virada Nirapathpongporn
2004 Jane Park
2005 Morgan Pressel
05/07/06 @ 10:17
One-Putt, Yes, you left someone out. Ty tryon. Did get a sponsors' exemption also?
05/07/06 @ 12:36
John Neal, What did that big check that Bubbles just earned do to her vaunted earnings-per-round statistic? Maybe some of the stat freaks on this board can come up with some info.
05/07/06 @ 13:13
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Alex, Ty Tryon is a member of the Korean Tour. His standings there qualified him for entry in the tournament. Unless his game shapes up considerably, he won't be a member of the Korean Tour for long either.
Michelle's earnings per round in Men's events went up considerably as a result of her winnings in the SK Telecom. $4,050/17 rounds is considerably larger than $0/14 rounds.
With respect to professional career earnings per round, it reduced them by about 1/3.
With respect to the "funny money" calculations which include what she "would have won" as an amateur. It didn't affect that very much at all.
Michelle's earnings per round in Men's events went up considerably as a result of her winnings in the SK Telecom. $4,050/17 rounds is considerably larger than $0/14 rounds.
With respect to professional career earnings per round, it reduced them by about 1/3.
With respect to the "funny money" calculations which include what she "would have won" as an amateur. It didn't affect that very much at all.
05/07/06 @ 13:43
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
"Comment from: Alex [Visitor] · http://Alex
John Neal, What did that big check that Bubbles just earned do to her vaunted earnings-per-round statistic? Maybe some of the stat freaks on this board can come up with some info."
Well Alex since this is the first time Michelle has earned any money in a Men's event it is a little difficult to give you an accurate average. After she makes the cut at the next three I can give you more accurate statistics. Well let me give it a go so far:
Let's seeeeeeeee Alex, BJ signed $6,000,000 worth of endorsement contracts for Michelle in Korea, her appearance fee with expense money was $750,000, her winnings were 4,100 and the publicity she received by making the cut was "priceless" for the William Morris Agency.
$6,754,100 divided by three tournament rounds of golf equals.........
Oh what the hell Alex, you do the math.
John Neal, What did that big check that Bubbles just earned do to her vaunted earnings-per-round statistic? Maybe some of the stat freaks on this board can come up with some info."
Well Alex since this is the first time Michelle has earned any money in a Men's event it is a little difficult to give you an accurate average. After she makes the cut at the next three I can give you more accurate statistics. Well let me give it a go so far:
Let's seeeeeeeee Alex, BJ signed $6,000,000 worth of endorsement contracts for Michelle in Korea, her appearance fee with expense money was $750,000, her winnings were 4,100 and the publicity she received by making the cut was "priceless" for the William Morris Agency.
$6,754,100 divided by three tournament rounds of golf equals.........
Oh what the hell Alex, you do the math.
05/07/06 @ 14:17
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
05/07/06 @ 15:33
While all of us Wie fans on these boards are in agreement that Miss Wie's stupendous victory today ranks right up there with Lord Byron's 12 consecutive PGA wins, Sarazen's "shot heard 'round the world", and the Tiger slam, there was a troublesome note. Although Michelle showed that she has learned to "close the deal" by holding off two Korean amateurs to win T35 by a single stroke, she was outscored in the event by three other Korean amateurs whose status as such surely has to be in question. One-Putt, you've shown outstanding investigative ability in uncovering golfing minutiae. It would be greatly appreciated if you would use that ability to unmask and expose these faux "amateurs" as the frauds that they are. There is absolutely no way that an amateur could ever beat Michelle Wie regardless of that person's gender. Well, since last summer's US Public links, anyway.
05/07/06 @ 16:21
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
One Putt said:
Did I leave anything out Norman?
***********************************
No, but given the lack of intelligence on the anti-Wie brigade side, I doubt they would have understood any of what you explained.
Did I leave anything out Norman?
***********************************
No, but given the lack of intelligence on the anti-Wie brigade side, I doubt they would have understood any of what you explained.
05/07/06 @ 19:49
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
hc2 said:
I really don't understand what the Golf
Channel is doing. They must have asked Dottie Pepper like a hundred times about Michelle Wie's progress or lack of; and her answer is like a tape recorder since she keeps saying the same thing: stick to women's juniors/amateurs. That is just dumb; we all know what she is gonna say; so why ask? I also wonder why they ask her about Michelle's progress since she has no clue what it takes to make in the men's tours. It's like asking a motorcycle mechanic to give you advice on how to fix a car. If you are going to ask anyone, ask someone who is experienced with the men's game.
**********************************
It is extremely strange that these women like to pick on Wie so much. They are lpga women and want Wie to stick to the lpga, but Wie plays the maximum number of lpga events she is allowed to play. She has even asked to be allowed to play more lpga event, but they have refused to let her.
On the amateur thing, it would be unfair to put any amateur up against Wie, given all of the coaching and money Wie has behind her.
I really don't understand what the Golf
Channel is doing. They must have asked Dottie Pepper like a hundred times about Michelle Wie's progress or lack of; and her answer is like a tape recorder since she keeps saying the same thing: stick to women's juniors/amateurs. That is just dumb; we all know what she is gonna say; so why ask? I also wonder why they ask her about Michelle's progress since she has no clue what it takes to make in the men's tours. It's like asking a motorcycle mechanic to give you advice on how to fix a car. If you are going to ask anyone, ask someone who is experienced with the men's game.
**********************************
It is extremely strange that these women like to pick on Wie so much. They are lpga women and want Wie to stick to the lpga, but Wie plays the maximum number of lpga events she is allowed to play. She has even asked to be allowed to play more lpga event, but they have refused to let her.
On the amateur thing, it would be unfair to put any amateur up against Wie, given all of the coaching and money Wie has behind her.
05/07/06 @ 19:56
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
I would say it is just being "Catty" Norman.
Michelle over the last couple of years has fared better than three fouths of the LPGA card holders or more. These women would kill to have Michelle's results.
Michelle over the last couple of years has fared better than three fouths of the LPGA card holders or more. These women would kill to have Michelle's results.
05/08/06 @ 03:21
Norman, One-Putt, putt4par, John Neal, et al, Since you fellows seem to know quite a lot about the various world golf tours and virtually everything about Michelle Wie from her bankroll to her career aspirations to the machinations of her agents, I'd appreciate your giving me a brief tutorial on a few pertinent things. I was under the impression that the SK Telecom was a minor tournament on a secondary tour. But I was abruptly told that The Asian Tour is of major quality, ranking only a little below the European Tour. And that the SK Telecom was a flagship event on that tour. Se Ri Pak had finished T10 in a men's tour but that was on the KOrean Tour which is of vastly inferior quality compared to the Asian. That became somewhat confusing when I inquired as to the reason Ty Tryon was in the SK field. One of you replied that Ty was in fact a member of the Korean tour and that his play had been substandard of late and that his Korean tour card was in jeopardy, BUT, that his stature on that tour qualified him for the SK. Then I asked about the somewhat dubious decision of the SK promoters of inviting several amateurs to what was purportedly a stellar(for Asia)field. Norman, I believe you replied that since Miss Wie was such a superior player and the recipient of so much expert instruction, it would be patently unfair to pit amateurs against a professional like Michelle. I agree, but apparently the organizers and sponsors Of the SK did not. They invited six amateurs to this Grade One event. In what must be one of the greatest surprises in golf history, one which has escaped the notice of golf writers worldwide, ALL of these amateurs made the cut! And even more surprising, three of the Incheon Six actually scored better than Michelle Wie! Has anything remotely similar to this ever occurred in modern golf history? I remember Phil and Scott Verplank winning PGA events as amateurs some years ago, but to have such a large number of amateurs do so well in a major tournament on a major tour is surely unprecedented. Fellows, you have the investigative ability and the resources. How do you account for this extraordinary result?
05/08/06 @ 07:50
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
Alex,
No problem. I'm glad you have at least grasped the bit about Se Ri Pak's performance being on a different tour. That is at least progress.
As regards the amateurs, hopefully I can give you some help there to.
As an amateur I received exemptions into a local every for a few years. There I finished ahead of many professionals, many of whom were far better players then, than Michell Wie is now.
Did that make me better than these top class pros that I finished ahead of?
Actually, being a naive youngster at the time, I thought it did, but it certainly did not as I later found out.
Perhaps you should check out any pga tour event, where amateurs are invited and I think you will easily find plenty of examples of them finishing ahead of top class professionals.
Actually just go back a few years in the Masters and you will find plenty of examples of amateurs making the cut, and bonefide top class high ranked players missing the cut.
As a further example, why not look up the results of Michelle Wie at The Sony Open in 2004. You should find that a certain amateur by the name of Michelle Wie, scored better than many top class pros, like top 10 ranked Adam Scott. Did that mean that she was in fact a better player than Adam Scott? No it didn't. It just means she scored better than him in that particular event.
I hope you have enjoyed this lesson Alex, and please don't hesitate to ask for more help, should you need it.
No problem. I'm glad you have at least grasped the bit about Se Ri Pak's performance being on a different tour. That is at least progress.
As regards the amateurs, hopefully I can give you some help there to.
As an amateur I received exemptions into a local every for a few years. There I finished ahead of many professionals, many of whom were far better players then, than Michell Wie is now.
Did that make me better than these top class pros that I finished ahead of?
Actually, being a naive youngster at the time, I thought it did, but it certainly did not as I later found out.
Perhaps you should check out any pga tour event, where amateurs are invited and I think you will easily find plenty of examples of them finishing ahead of top class professionals.
Actually just go back a few years in the Masters and you will find plenty of examples of amateurs making the cut, and bonefide top class high ranked players missing the cut.
As a further example, why not look up the results of Michelle Wie at The Sony Open in 2004. You should find that a certain amateur by the name of Michelle Wie, scored better than many top class pros, like top 10 ranked Adam Scott. Did that mean that she was in fact a better player than Adam Scott? No it didn't. It just means she scored better than him in that particular event.
I hope you have enjoyed this lesson Alex, and please don't hesitate to ask for more help, should you need it.
05/08/06 @ 11:36
Comment from: Calvin [Visitor]
There is a simple golfing vaccine that will stop the potential feminine infection of the PGA tour dead in its tracks, including the one female carrying the virus known as Wiemania.
1. Prior to the PGA tour event, "Grow the rough"
2. During the first 2 rounds of the PGA tour event, "Hide the pins".
For simplicity just shorten it to, "GRHP or Grow the rough and Hide the pins".
1. Prior to the PGA tour event, "Grow the rough"
2. During the first 2 rounds of the PGA tour event, "Hide the pins".
For simplicity just shorten it to, "GRHP or Grow the rough and Hide the pins".
05/08/06 @ 17:30
Comment from: putt4par [Visitor]
Jen, this is a comment that was posted to an earlier article by you but I think it pretty much sums up the efect Michelle is having on golf. (other than making ol' Alex crazy I mean)
http://www.travelgolf.com/blogs/jennifer.mario/2005/10/05/michelle%5Fwie%5Fgoes%5Fpro%5Fwomen%5Fs%5Fgolf%5Fgets
Comment from: Julie [Visitor]
I agree with everything you said. In my opinion, Morgan is just jealous, and since she's only a kid herself, I sort of understand her jealousy. But she should not be expressing them in public as that only makes her look immature next to Michelle. As for that woman Nancy, I wonder if she has daughters. If she does, would she tell them never to go after their dream if it meant competing against men? She's not old-fashioned. She's narrow-minded and petty.
(::)
I'm a 40-year-old woman who has never played golf. I was never interested in golf and never watched golf on TV until Michelle started playing in the LPGA events. I know a lot of people who watch those evetns on TV only when Michelle's playing. My 15-year-old daughter just started playing golf at her high school after watching Michelle play. Michelle is good for women's golf. Michelle is good for men's golf. Michelle's good for golf, period.
(::)
04/03/06 @ 02:28
Alex, be a sport and hush up, you do not....I repeat, you do not do a thing for the game of golf. Likewise, neither does Baldwin.
Try to grow old gracefully, old man. Put your teeth in a glass to soak along with your head.
Thanks in advance for the silence.
http://www.travelgolf.com/blogs/jennifer.mario/2005/10/05/michelle%5Fwie%5Fgoes%5Fpro%5Fwomen%5Fs%5Fgolf%5Fgets
Comment from: Julie [Visitor]
I agree with everything you said. In my opinion, Morgan is just jealous, and since she's only a kid herself, I sort of understand her jealousy. But she should not be expressing them in public as that only makes her look immature next to Michelle. As for that woman Nancy, I wonder if she has daughters. If she does, would she tell them never to go after their dream if it meant competing against men? She's not old-fashioned. She's narrow-minded and petty.
(::)
I'm a 40-year-old woman who has never played golf. I was never interested in golf and never watched golf on TV until Michelle started playing in the LPGA events. I know a lot of people who watch those evetns on TV only when Michelle's playing. My 15-year-old daughter just started playing golf at her high school after watching Michelle play. Michelle is good for women's golf. Michelle is good for men's golf. Michelle's good for golf, period.
(::)
04/03/06 @ 02:28
Alex, be a sport and hush up, you do not....I repeat, you do not do a thing for the game of golf. Likewise, neither does Baldwin.
Try to grow old gracefully, old man. Put your teeth in a glass to soak along with your head.
Thanks in advance for the silence.
05/08/06 @ 19:42
Comment from: Paul W [Visitor]
As biased as Dottie Pepper is on the subject of Wie playing men's events, the guy on Grey Goose who's friends with Pressel is even worse. He said on the show the only reason she was allowed to play in the SK Open was because the sponser was being PC. Makes zero sense (unless PC means Plenty of Cash). I guess "commentators" don't need to understand economics.
05/08/06 @ 20:20
Comment from: hc2 [Visitor]
I think we can now stop paying attention to the many of the so called commentarists, that the Golf Channel hires. The Grey Goose guy is just a loudmouth who has as much knowledge of golf as your average fan behind the ropes. I have no idea why he is there. Similarly Dottie Pepper and Nancy Lopez were recently hired just because of their name and not because of their skill in commentating about golf. They are players; not commentarists which are two separate things. I think being a commentarist is a craft that requires skill; just because you are a golfer does not mean you will make a good commentarist. A commentarist needs to step aside, look at both sides of the story, and not just reitereate what was discussed in the locker rooms with their fellow tour members.
For a good example, of professional commentarists on golf, I suggest reading this recent article from ESPN/Golf Digest which pinpoints what are Michelle's realistic chances to make it in the PGA tour. Both pros and cons are shown with a very objective perspective. They are from both Bob Harig and Ron Sirak, and you could tell that these guys really know what they are talking about.
http://sports.espn.go.com/golf/news/story?id=2437446
For a good example, of professional commentarists on golf, I suggest reading this recent article from ESPN/Golf Digest which pinpoints what are Michelle's realistic chances to make it in the PGA tour. Both pros and cons are shown with a very objective perspective. They are from both Bob Harig and Ron Sirak, and you could tell that these guys really know what they are talking about.
http://sports.espn.go.com/golf/news/story?id=2437446
05/09/06 @ 00:29
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
Commentators who are players find themselves unable to relate to Michelle and how far she has risen up the ranks in such a short time. Michelle is a unique talent that doesn't fit into the neat little box Dottie, Beth or Nancy thinks that young golfers should be placed into. Rising up the Amateur ranks until they graduate into fold of the Almighty LPGA.
What they fail to recognize is that age 14, 15 and now at 16 Michelle would have qualified for LPGA exempt status if she were a professional. This was while playing in only seven or eight LPGA events a year. In 2005 for example she would have placed 16th on the money list after playing in only seven events as an amateur. That says to me the competition is not very strong save for the very few consistent players on the tour.
Success breeds resentment and Michelle has gathered bucket loads of resentment from the players who took the traditional route and still can't match her consistency of play.
What they fail to recognize is that age 14, 15 and now at 16 Michelle would have qualified for LPGA exempt status if she were a professional. This was while playing in only seven or eight LPGA events a year. In 2005 for example she would have placed 16th on the money list after playing in only seven events as an amateur. That says to me the competition is not very strong save for the very few consistent players on the tour.
Success breeds resentment and Michelle has gathered bucket loads of resentment from the players who took the traditional route and still can't match her consistency of play.
05/09/06 @ 03:16
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
It is pretty easy to see why Michelle is ranked Number Two in the Rolex rankings (off and on).
She averaged over $90,000 per event in potential or real earnings in the past 15 events. Only Annika has a higher earning percentage. Paula was nearly $30,000 per event behind in per event earnings in 2005 and finished Number Two on the money list.
The last time Michelle missed an LPGA cut was when she was thirteen (at the 2003 Jamie Farr OCC).
She averaged over $90,000 per event in potential or real earnings in the past 15 events. Only Annika has a higher earning percentage. Paula was nearly $30,000 per event behind in per event earnings in 2005 and finished Number Two on the money list.
The last time Michelle missed an LPGA cut was when she was thirteen (at the 2003 Jamie Farr OCC).
05/09/06 @ 15:17
Comment from: hc2 [Visitor]
I don't think using the dollar average per event is a good method for determining the ranking of a player. Michelle would overly benefit from that system because she plays mostly majors (Kraft Nabisco, US Women's Open, etc) where the purses are larger; while she does not participate in those events with smaller purses. If she were to play the smaller purse tournaments her average would naturally come down. I think a mixture of how a player placed in each tournament, and the strength of the field should determine the rankings.
05/09/06 @ 16:13
Comment from: Candace Polski [Visitor]
That's true hc2, it's not a perfect measure. Which is why these rankings incorporate other statistics than just money. But consider this - you receive a tour card and expemption based on where you placed on the money list. So dollars per tournament would be a pretty good proxy for that important listing...
05/09/06 @ 17:08
Comment from: Jay [Visitor]
***************************
I'm a 40-year-old woman who has never played golf. I was never interested in golf and never watched golf on TV until Michelle started playing in the LPGA events. I know a lot of people who watch those evetns on TV only when Michelle's playing. My 15-year-old daughter just started playing golf at her high school after watching Michelle play. Michelle is good for women's golf. Michelle is good for men's golf. Michelle's good for golf, period.
*************************
I agree with Putt4Par. I never played golf let alone watch the 'boring' thing, until Michelle Wie appeared. I started to follow her tours and then I started to play golf myself. I think golf is a sports that a young kid should learn at an early age. It will help overall development of the child.
In any case, Michelle Wie's effect on golf surpasses Tiger Woods. (who cares about Tiger Woods unless you were a golfer already)
Enough said.
I'm a 40-year-old woman who has never played golf. I was never interested in golf and never watched golf on TV until Michelle started playing in the LPGA events. I know a lot of people who watch those evetns on TV only when Michelle's playing. My 15-year-old daughter just started playing golf at her high school after watching Michelle play. Michelle is good for women's golf. Michelle is good for men's golf. Michelle's good for golf, period.
*************************
I agree with Putt4Par. I never played golf let alone watch the 'boring' thing, until Michelle Wie appeared. I started to follow her tours and then I started to play golf myself. I think golf is a sports that a young kid should learn at an early age. It will help overall development of the child.
In any case, Michelle Wie's effect on golf surpasses Tiger Woods. (who cares about Tiger Woods unless you were a golfer already)
Enough said.
05/09/06 @ 21:01
Paul W, When you and the other Wie Warriors actually complain about Dottie Pepper being biased against Miss Wie, you have shown that you have more nerve than the guy who ate the first oyster. Must be more of that absinthe and LSD laden Koolaid. The pro-Wie bias in the media and on these boards gets more convoluted every day.
05/09/06 @ 21:14
Did anybody watch David Blaine's aquarium stunt on ABC? He could have pulled the stunt off by using liquid oxygen instead of salt water. If he didn't want to use liquid oxygen for the whole 7 days, he could have slowly substituted it before the big stunt. I once saw this rat "drowning" in liquid oxygen before realizing it could "breath" the stuff through its lungs. If he used this trick nobody would have been the wiser.
05/09/06 @ 21:21
Wait up, liquid oxygen might be too volatile. Don't know if the fire marshalls would ban it for use in the stunt.
05/09/06 @ 21:26
Comment from: putt4par [Visitor]
Comment from: Paul W [Visitor]
As biased as Dottie Pepper is on the subject of Wie playing men's events, the guy on Grey Goose who's friends with Pressel is even worse. He said on the show the only reason she was allowed to play in the SK Open was because the sponser was being PC. Makes zero sense (unless PC means Plenty of Cash). I guess "commentators" don't need to understand economics.
On the TGC forumn there is a thread about Dottie Pepper.
Here is one comment from a reliable witness.. Or at least as reliable as Alex will ever be.
From: golfgirl1 (262 of 274) 5/9/2006 3:27:44 PM
To: hoodman9 In response to Post 6
I was 'sign girl' :) for Dottie and Chris Johnson final round of the Safeway Classic in 1997 (maybe 96?) and Dottie did not come off as a very nice woman. Yes, she was in the final round poised to win, but a 'hello', 'thank you', an old golf ball, an autograph after the round, anything at anytime would have been appreciated. Chris Johnson on the other hand was one of the nicest women on the LPGA. She actually apoligized for Dottie's behavior. I did that for 7 years, met a lot of the LPGA women and Dottie definitely stood out...and not in a good way!
Alex and whoever else thinks that the Pepper Mouth is unbiased and fair needs to go back and research some of the newspapers and TV interviews as well as comments from golfers and commentators of the day.
She is one very biased and bad tempered person. She is an avowed Pressel fan as well, so guess what she isn't going to do for MW. Be Fair, you think?
As biased as Dottie Pepper is on the subject of Wie playing men's events, the guy on Grey Goose who's friends with Pressel is even worse. He said on the show the only reason she was allowed to play in the SK Open was because the sponser was being PC. Makes zero sense (unless PC means Plenty of Cash). I guess "commentators" don't need to understand economics.
On the TGC forumn there is a thread about Dottie Pepper.
Here is one comment from a reliable witness.. Or at least as reliable as Alex will ever be.
From: golfgirl1 (262 of 274) 5/9/2006 3:27:44 PM
To: hoodman9 In response to Post 6
I was 'sign girl' :) for Dottie and Chris Johnson final round of the Safeway Classic in 1997 (maybe 96?) and Dottie did not come off as a very nice woman. Yes, she was in the final round poised to win, but a 'hello', 'thank you', an old golf ball, an autograph after the round, anything at anytime would have been appreciated. Chris Johnson on the other hand was one of the nicest women on the LPGA. She actually apoligized for Dottie's behavior. I did that for 7 years, met a lot of the LPGA women and Dottie definitely stood out...and not in a good way!
Alex and whoever else thinks that the Pepper Mouth is unbiased and fair needs to go back and research some of the newspapers and TV interviews as well as comments from golfers and commentators of the day.
She is one very biased and bad tempered person. She is an avowed Pressel fan as well, so guess what she isn't going to do for MW. Be Fair, you think?
05/09/06 @ 22:11
Comment from: hc2 [Visitor]
At the end, the players that have class in manners stand out; Paula Creamer has it, so does Michelle, and Lorena. If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say it at all. That's just basic values instilled by parents on their children at an early age; and if a player like Pressell; or Pepper never learned it, they never will.
05/09/06 @ 22:57
Comment from: putt4par [Visitor]
Actually I think that Morgan is or has learned it. She is really great with the young kids that ask for autographs etc. Nothing like Dottie at all.
And of course there are many on that tour that are class all the way, Paula, Natalie, Lorena, Christina Kim, Julie Inkster. A long list of classy ladies.
But unfortunately it only takes one bitchy little mouth off to make the rest look bad.
And of course there are many on that tour that are class all the way, Paula, Natalie, Lorena, Christina Kim, Julie Inkster. A long list of classy ladies.
But unfortunately it only takes one bitchy little mouth off to make the rest look bad.
05/09/06 @ 23:31
Comment from: Candace Polski [Visitor]
Hmmm...maybe Brian, maybe not. According to Alex, Wie can't win anything, after all.
On the nice player issue, I cannot speak to Dottie Pepper, but I did have a chance to see several of the players live at a tournament pro am recently. Very instructive. Creamer was actually quite cold and almost angry with the amateurs she was playing with, while Pressel was high fiving and smiling and having a good time with them. Quite the opposite of what you would think based on their TV and print interviews. So it's not always so easy to see which players are fan friendly and which aren't.
On the nice player issue, I cannot speak to Dottie Pepper, but I did have a chance to see several of the players live at a tournament pro am recently. Very instructive. Creamer was actually quite cold and almost angry with the amateurs she was playing with, while Pressel was high fiving and smiling and having a good time with them. Quite the opposite of what you would think based on their TV and print interviews. So it's not always so easy to see which players are fan friendly and which aren't.
05/10/06 @ 03:16
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
"Comment from: hc2 [Visitor]
I don't think using the dollar average per event is a good method for determining the ranking of a player. Michelle would overly benefit from that system because she plays mostly majors (Kraft Nabisco, US Women's Open, etc) where the purses are larger; while she does not participate in those events with smaller purses. If she were to play the smaller purse tournaments her average would naturally come down. I think a mixture of how a player placed in each tournament, and the strength of the field should determine the rankings. "
Thanks for making my point hc2. Yes the Rolex gives more weight to the Majors and how high you finish.
For the Majors held from 2005 to the Kraft this year the figures are on track for Michelle averaging a little over $90,000 per each ot the five tournaments. Paula averaged around $44,000 for the five Majors and Annika came in with an whopping average of $144,000 per event over the five Major tournaments.
Yes Michelle could use her few exemptions to play weaker fields, but she is used to teeing it up with the best players in the world and doing quite well in the process. Hey what do you learn from somebody that plays poorly? You always learn something from someone who is a better player in the field.
I look at Michelle as a work in progress. She still has rough edges on her game that more experience will smooth out. Her improvement in "Course Management" have been evident in her last three events. When she has a bogey now it is likely based on poor shot execution and not on poor decision making which was her problem in the past.
Her putting average was outstanding for the SK Open, including adding in the average for the final round. In her last two LPGA events she was in first place for GIR in one and tied for first in the other. If she had averaged the same putting of 1.75 putts at the SK per GIR in the two LPGA events, she would have easily run away from the field.
I don't think using the dollar average per event is a good method for determining the ranking of a player. Michelle would overly benefit from that system because she plays mostly majors (Kraft Nabisco, US Women's Open, etc) where the purses are larger; while she does not participate in those events with smaller purses. If she were to play the smaller purse tournaments her average would naturally come down. I think a mixture of how a player placed in each tournament, and the strength of the field should determine the rankings. "
Thanks for making my point hc2. Yes the Rolex gives more weight to the Majors and how high you finish.
For the Majors held from 2005 to the Kraft this year the figures are on track for Michelle averaging a little over $90,000 per each ot the five tournaments. Paula averaged around $44,000 for the five Majors and Annika came in with an whopping average of $144,000 per event over the five Major tournaments.
Yes Michelle could use her few exemptions to play weaker fields, but she is used to teeing it up with the best players in the world and doing quite well in the process. Hey what do you learn from somebody that plays poorly? You always learn something from someone who is a better player in the field.
I look at Michelle as a work in progress. She still has rough edges on her game that more experience will smooth out. Her improvement in "Course Management" have been evident in her last three events. When she has a bogey now it is likely based on poor shot execution and not on poor decision making which was her problem in the past.
Her putting average was outstanding for the SK Open, including adding in the average for the final round. In her last two LPGA events she was in first place for GIR in one and tied for first in the other. If she had averaged the same putting of 1.75 putts at the SK per GIR in the two LPGA events, she would have easily run away from the field.
05/10/06 @ 04:14
Comment from: hc2 [Visitor]
Yes, I did notice some improvement on Michelle's putting stroke at the Kraft; but she still came out with a very high avg: I believe it was 31 putts per round. Basically if she had averaged 29 putts per round, she would have easily won by four or five shots. I find it hard to believe that she can develop feel in her putting in such a short span of a few weeks. I think we won't know until the next two events she enters. If her putting has indeed improved, then indeed the sky is the limit for her this summer: a couple of wins in the lpga; and a significant milestone in the pga: making it to the US Open, making the cut at the John Deere, etc.
By the way, how significant would it be if Michelle were to qualify to the US Open; but once there, would not make the cut there? Would it be more of a feat than making the cut at the John Deere?
By the way, how significant would it be if Michelle were to qualify to the US Open; but once there, would not make the cut there? Would it be more of a feat than making the cut at the John Deere?
05/10/06 @ 06:19
Comment from: James COULTHARD [Visitor]
Yes. Qualifying for the US Open event if she misses the cut would be a greater accomplishment than just making the cut at the John Deere.
05/10/06 @ 06:58
Comment from: Paul W [Visitor]
I guess we can all calm down about Michelle making a cut in a men's event. Morgan Pressel has said it's no big deal: "I'm sure there are many girls that could go out there and make a cut or so in the men's event, they just don't wish to do that."
Odd that she doesn't plan to try herself.
Odd that she doesn't plan to try herself.
05/10/06 @ 09:32
Comment from: hc2 [Visitor]
The 'making a cut in a Men's event- not a big deal' point of view is missing the point on what the actual purpose is for Michelle playing in the Men's event. The main purpose is to explore what is the highest a highly underdog player (woman) can achieve provided that she has all the tools: golf coach, perfect swing, ideal physique, etc. In essence, the aim is to make history, and break mental barriers of what is possible in life. That is something everyone,including non sports fans, can relate to.
05/10/06 @ 11:52
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
But Morgan missing the cut in an LPGA event is a big deal for you, after all Michelle was 14 when that last happened.
I guess Michelle will just have to console herself with her new $3,000,000 contract from Korea.
If Michelle were fortunate enough to make the U.S. Open field it would be one of the greatest moments in golf history. Making the cut would make her a golf legend.
Her winning the U.S Open would give Alex and I a stroke for different reasons. But I think we are quite safe from that happening.
I guess Michelle will just have to console herself with her new $3,000,000 contract from Korea.
If Michelle were fortunate enough to make the U.S. Open field it would be one of the greatest moments in golf history. Making the cut would make her a golf legend.
Her winning the U.S Open would give Alex and I a stroke for different reasons. But I think we are quite safe from that happening.
05/10/06 @ 13:16
Jennifer, Just one question. If the SK Telecom Open is actually true to its name, an OPEN, and since Miss Wie competed in it, why do you then describe it as a "men's" event? Could it be that no woman or girl, not even Michelle Wie, has ever qualified fot it?
05/10/06 @ 13:42
Comment from: Johnny N. [Visitor]
I thought Pressel might have matured a bit.
Didn't she miss her last lpga cut?
Then she goes insulting Wie's historic cut at a mens event.
She thinks plenty of women could make the cut there. Alex is wrong about many things, but perhaps even Alex agrees that there are not plenty of lpga players who could make a cut on a 7100 yard course.
Didn't she miss her last lpga cut?
Then she goes insulting Wie's historic cut at a mens event.
She thinks plenty of women could make the cut there. Alex is wrong about many things, but perhaps even Alex agrees that there are not plenty of lpga players who could make a cut on a 7100 yard course.
05/10/06 @ 14:22
Comment from: Jim COULTHARD [Visitor]
The SK Telecom is an Open because it is open to both pros and amateurs. It is a men's event because men are allowed to compete and traditionally only males compete. Like the men's events in the Olympics it should probably be called an age and gender neutral event.
05/10/06 @ 14:33
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
"Comment from: Alex [Visitor] · http://Alex
Jennifer, Just one question. If the SK Telecom Open is actually true to its name, an OPEN, and since Miss Wie competed in it, why do you then describe it as a "men's" event? Could it be that no woman or girl, not even Michelle Wie, has ever qualified fot it?"
The "Open" events on the PGA tour and LPGA tour are open to those members that are holding "Conditional Cards for their respective tours".
They use "Monday Qualifying" to obtain a position in the field.
Jennifer, Just one question. If the SK Telecom Open is actually true to its name, an OPEN, and since Miss Wie competed in it, why do you then describe it as a "men's" event? Could it be that no woman or girl, not even Michelle Wie, has ever qualified fot it?"
The "Open" events on the PGA tour and LPGA tour are open to those members that are holding "Conditional Cards for their respective tours".
They use "Monday Qualifying" to obtain a position in the field.
05/12/06 @ 07:24
One-Putt, In your opinion, how many times would a female have to compete in an event before it would not be considered a "men's" event? Similarly, how many females would have to be entered in an single tournament for it to lose its label as a men's event? One? Two? Or ten?
05/12/06 @ 08:17
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
"Comment from: Alex [Visitor] · http://Alex
One-Putt, In your opinion, how many times would a female have to compete in an event before it would not be considered a "men's" event? Similarly, how many females would have to be entered in an single tournament for it to lose its label as a men's event? One? Two? Or ten?"
I recall in our history a time when American women could not vote, own property, play golf or go out without heavy clothes from head to toe. Much like a Muslim woman today minus the stoning.
I recall in our history a time when men or women of color had no rights in America and were owned as property by a "Master". The only time they stepped onto a golf course was to work there.
As a society we evolved beyond these times and called it progress. Modern Americans would not label a golf game as anything Alex except what it really is: A Golf tournament. A game played with sticks and little white balls around a gathering of open fields each with a hole placed at one end.
Golf is not a life or death event, although they speak of sudden death playoffs where nobody seems to really die. If someone loses a golf match they will not be stoned to death or sent to a cell to rot for eternaty. They are able to try one more time to succeed.
Your problem Alex is accepting thr fact that it is just a game and if you can play just go ahead and tee it up.
One-Putt, In your opinion, how many times would a female have to compete in an event before it would not be considered a "men's" event? Similarly, how many females would have to be entered in an single tournament for it to lose its label as a men's event? One? Two? Or ten?"
I recall in our history a time when American women could not vote, own property, play golf or go out without heavy clothes from head to toe. Much like a Muslim woman today minus the stoning.
I recall in our history a time when men or women of color had no rights in America and were owned as property by a "Master". The only time they stepped onto a golf course was to work there.
As a society we evolved beyond these times and called it progress. Modern Americans would not label a golf game as anything Alex except what it really is: A Golf tournament. A game played with sticks and little white balls around a gathering of open fields each with a hole placed at one end.
Golf is not a life or death event, although they speak of sudden death playoffs where nobody seems to really die. If someone loses a golf match they will not be stoned to death or sent to a cell to rot for eternaty. They are able to try one more time to succeed.
Your problem Alex is accepting thr fact that it is just a game and if you can play just go ahead and tee it up.
05/12/06 @ 23:18
One-Putt, That was very nice of you to brief me on world and American history and some of the darker periods, but I fail to see any relevance in a blog on the game of golf. O-P, old buddy, what have you been drinking? Did you OD on "non-sequitur" pills?
05/13/06 @ 07:21
Brian, You have every right and more than ample reson to feel humble.
05/13/06 @ 18:20
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
Yes Brian our friend Alex is the Clarence Darrow of the golf blogs.
05/14/06 @ 02:28
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Actually One-Putt, Alex is currently the William Jennings Bryan of the golf blogs, earnestly defending the status-quo of Ancient Golfing Beliefs against the heresies of the Wieites.
05/14/06 @ 11:58
Comment from: hc2 [Visitor]
This Alex guy is more obsessed with Wie than all Wie supporters combined. I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up as one of those weirdos stalking Michelle.
05/15/06 @ 01:11
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
I'm rooting for Michelle to do well in her US Open qualifier today. The first round of Regionals takes place on "The Palmer Course" at Turtle Bay, the course where she finished second at the SBS in 2005.
05/15/06 @ 05:05
Comment from: Rob Durkee, North Hollywood [Visitor]
Congratulations, Michelle Weak. You're the only golfer in history to earn a headline for finishing DEAD LAST in a men's golf tournament.
Do the 84 Lumber Classic field a favor...and withdraw!
Do the 84 Lumber Classic field a favor...and withdraw!
09/09/06 @ 17:36
This post has 1 feedback awaiting moderation...
Comment feed for this post
Kiel Christianson:
The Accidental Golfer:
Jason Scott Deegan:
View from Europe:
Recent comments