Golf Media Triangle: Tiger Woods at Dubai, Michelle Wie, and John Daly

Congrats Tiger for bringing your amazing talent in Dubai!!! You deserved all the money you're getting inside and outside of the tournament.

Yet another Tiger victory.

I'm not at all surprised that he won. Some people like to go on about how Ernie Else is just as good, if not better, than Tiger (e.g. Seve Ballesteros).

But Els is not nearly as good; he's just a part of the 'rest of the golfing world,' i.e. somebody who folds when going head-to-head against Tiger.

It always happens. His fellow pros either roll over and play dead and shrink from the challenge, or last a while only to fall at the final hurdle.

Well done, Tiger!

It certainly does look like another case of Tiger just letting his opponents make the critical errors when it matters most. Els played extremely well all week and closed with a final round 67, but it was Woods who once again saved his best for last birding the final two holes to force the playoff. In the playoff Els hooked his drive underneath some trees and then promptly dumped his second shot in the water effectively ending his day. What I find more telling than the fact that another player seemingly folded in the face of a playoff with Tiger is Els reaction afterwards. I cannot complain," said Els, who is coming back from knee surgery last year. "After all the hassle I had with the leg to come back ... and to almost win is fine." To "almost" win is fine can you imagine Tiger saying this, never. This is what seperates Tiger from the rest of the world, killer instinct along with knowing what it takes to get in position to win and then making it happen, becuase contrary to what Ernie Els, Phil Mickleson, Michelle Wie and her fans including our good friend Norman say winning is everything.

Michelle could take a few lessons from this sixteen year old gal:

From TGC

"QUEENSLAND, Australia -- Amy Yang, a local 16-year-old high school student, birdied the first playoff hole against American Catherine Cartwright to win the ANZ Australian Ladies Masters on Sunday.

The South Korean, who attends nearby Robina High School on the Gold Coast, become the first amateur to win a major women's professional golf tournament in Australia.

She bogeyed the final hole in regulation to fall into a tie with Cartwright at 13-under 275 on the Royal Pines course."

Of course this was the highest finish Cartwright has ever had during her five years playing events on the LPGA tour.

Karrie Webb the defending champ finished tied for 33rd place and Ai Miyazato finished tied for 49th place.

A very nice result for Amy Yang--but it seems unfair to expect Michelle Wie to win a tournament in which she is not even playing. Let's wait until Michelle Wie plays on the LPGA later this month before making any judgements about lessons that she should take.

Michelle and her handlers could take many lessons from Amy Yang's performance. First lesson: Winning
Second lesson: Tournament selection-Michelle should be focusing on learning how to win, that means at this stage of her development playing in tournaments such as this one where she has a reasonable chance of competing for the title. While Michelle is holding press conferences announcing which sponser's exemptions she will be taking and what men's tournaments she will be trying to make the cut at, another 16 year-old was out winning a title. I forget her name, but the girl that beat Michelle in the 2004 U.S. Amateur placed third in this event, she was the one who said that she hit the ball just as far as Michelle and was just as good. I think a lot of people will be saying the same thing if Michelle does not abandon her notion of beating the men and focus on winning some women's titles first. The bubble on teens winning on tour has been burst, Michelle is no longer an anomoly, she needs to tone down the hype and beef up the resume.

Funny, blame Wie for not winning a tournament she is not playing. Impressive victory for Amy Yang, holding the lead from the second round on. I wonder if SBS Turtle Bay would invite Amy to play there, now that Michelle seems to be out.

Our problem is that Michelle apparently thinks she's 'too good' for such tournaments. If it's good enough for Karrie Webb, it's good enough for Michelle Wie.

Exactly - teenagers winning on tour is no longer so unusual. It's not as though Michelle was the first to do it, though - she hasn't won anything yet! - so why's all the fuss and hype over Michelle, and not over Yang or some other teen prodigy who cuts through the hype and actually shows a good performance?

In short, she's too busy trying to beat the men when she hasn't even beaten the women yet!

The ANZ is not an LPGA event. Michelle Wie will certainly play in the Fields Open, and quite possibly the SBS as well. There will be considerable pressure on her to win. She was quite right to focus her attention on the one or two Hawaiian LPGA events later this month and not run off to Australia at this time for a tournament that would be likely to distract her from her focus. Karrie Webb is Australian so for her the ANZ is the equivalent of the Hawaiian events for Michelle.

Michelle can only take two weeks off from high school a semester for tournaments. That is Punahou's rule and keeps her from competing in many events she might want to play in.

That's the truth, one-putt. I thought that we had established that Wie is restricted due to her scholastic commitments, something that Pressel, Creamer, Lang, and other young players are not. Evidentally our viewers forget that fact from week to week. When school lets out or when Spring Break starts, watch out for the full force of Wie.

Let us set the Michelle Wie battle aside for once.

Amy Yang won the most prestigous womens golf tournament played in Australia. She did it as a 16 year old amateur.

That is tremendous.

It does not need to have any bric-a-brac tacked about it. It does not matter how good or bad any other golfers who were or were not there may be. It matters that she faced everyone who came, played her game and pulled it out in a shoot-out. Exactly like Tiger did at Dubai.

End of a great story, very probable beginning of a brilliant career.

Let's not hang any more baggage on the moment...let it stand.

David said:'so why's all the fuss and hype over Michelle, and not over Yang or some other teen prodigy who cuts through the hype and actually shows a good performance?'
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In my opinion, it's the looks, the swing and her personna. Ordinary folks want Michelle to do well because she is unusually tall for a teen; has a beatiful swing, has girl next door looks, and talks softly and sweetly. Who said winning matters?

Amy Yang did a great job bringing home the win.

I am a little surprised more of the pros did not challenge her for the title. The LPGA Pro who finished highest in the order behind Yang, was Catherine Cartwright.

Cartwright is a five year LPGA veteran with a less than stellar record:

Status: Non-exempt
Career-best finish: T7
Career-low round: 67
Career earnings (rank): $203,489 (324)

She has appeared in 58 LPGA events and made the cut 29 times.

2005 Stats (rank):

Rds under par: 11/65 (121) Rds in the 60s: 4/65 (118) Birdies: 185 (64)
Eagles: 4 (23) Greens in reg: 66.9% (54) Driving accuracy: 70.8% (101)
Sand saves: 37.9% (66) Putts per GIR: 1.87 (123) Driving avg: 258.7 (11)

Ranked 98 on the ADT money list for 2005.

An article in the Chicago Tribune stated that Ernie Els gave the Tiger a "gift" win by hitting his second shot in the water. The fact of the matter is...he was intimidated by Woods on the first playoff hole. When Woods put his tee shot in the middle of the fairway, Els knew the Tiger would be on the green in two. Soooo Chicago, give the Tiger the credit that he deserves.

David said:
It always happens. His fellow pros either roll over and play dead and shrink from the challenge, or last a while only to fall at the final hurdle.
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If it always happens, should he not have won all of his 21 pga events last year. He failed to win 15 of those events so it doesn't always happen.
Also, there was 6 times when he finished in the top 3 without winning, so he had a 50% conversion rate when in the top 3 last year.

So people should stop trying to make out that when he near the top, he always wins, because he certainly doesn't.

Jackson said:
What I find more telling than the fact that another player seemingly folded in the face of a playoff with Tiger is Els reaction afterwards. I cannot complain," said Els, who is coming back from knee surgery last year. "After all the hassle I had with the leg to come back ... and to almost win is fine." To "almost" win is fine CAN YOU IMAGINE TIGER SAYING THIS, never. This is what seperates Tiger from the rest of the world, killer instinct along with knowing what it takes to get in position to win and then making it happen, becuase contrary to what Ernie Els, Phil Mickleson, Michelle Wie and her fans including our good friend Norman say winning is everything.
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Actually Tiger said the same thing when he finished 2nd at the Tour Championships, and then 2nd a week later at the HSBC in China. Tiger said he was very pleased. He said he was delighted and that he had had two very good weeks.

If you think Ernie should not be happy with finishing 2nd to Tiger in a playoff, given his injury, then you obviously don't know very much about coming back after injuries. Ernie should be and probably is, delighted with the progress he has made.

Like Tiger, Ernie want to play well now, and winning is a bonus, but the most important thing for him is to know that he is getting in shape for the majors.

Jim Coulthard said:
A very nice result for Amy Yang--but it seems unfair to expect Michelle Wie to win a tournament in which she is not even playing. Let's wait until Michelle Wie plays on the LPGA later this month before making any judgements about lessons that she should take.
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Jim, the thing is, that many people believe it is important to pick whoever the winner in whatever tournament is played and then say that they are better than Wie.

This is quite an easy game to play, because it means you don't even have to predict anything in advance. All you need to do is look at the final standings and pick this weeks winner and then claim that she is better than Wie.

When Ai Mirayato won q-school by a big margin, it was claimed that this made her better than Wie, who wasn't in that tournament.
The same people who said this, haven't been shouting about her 49th place finish at the weekend, or maybe I just missed them shouting about it.

If Amy Yang goes on to perform well on the lpga, I think she will deserve great acknowledgements.

Hopefully, like Michelle, she will do well.

David said:
Exactly - teenagers winning on tour is no longer so unusual. It's not as though Michelle was the first to do it, though - she hasn't won anything yet! - so why's all the fuss and hype over Michelle, and not over Yang or some other teen prodigy who cuts through the hype and actually shows a good performance?
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It depends what tour, you are talking about. Given that this event was a poor one, winning isn't as big a deal.
Although she should still be congratulated.

To win on the lpga tour, would be a much tougher prospect for Amy Yang.

FUNNY FUNNY FUNNY FUNNY FUNNY FUNNY FUNNY FUNNY FUNNY FUNNY

Here is a really funny quote from a guy who heads the school's golf program which Yang joined:

"She is now the new (teenage Hawaiian sensation) Michelle Wie. She will be every bit as good . . . and probably hits the ball longer off the tee. Amy hits it probably as far as most male professionals, and she really has the world at her feet."

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Either he is completely exagerating,
or else she will do huge things in golf.

** Jim, the thing is, that many people believe it is important to pick whoever the winner in whatever tournament is played and then say that they are better than Wie. **

Much as how you and the other Wie Warriors figure that even without a win, Wie had a better season than somebody like Paula Creamer!

-George

So winning a "poor" event isn't that big a deal now Norman. Someone who has defended Michelle Wie's record by offering up such titles as the Jennie K. Wilson and the Women's Publinx is now saying that winning a co-sactioned women's pro tournament is no big deal. As I have suspected all along you and the rest of the Wie apologists don't really care about wins, you like Wie care about media coverage and money. She makes a bigger splash missing cuts in men's events than she would winning a lower tier women's event, provided she could win, which is highly doubtful. You say that winning on the LPGA tour will be difficult for Yang, of course it will, it's obviously difficult for Michelle as well, and Yang now has something on her resume which Michelle does not, a pro win. I'm not saying that Amy Yang will win on the LPGA before Michelle, I'm also not saying that she will have a better career than Michelle, but she does have one more win than Michelle and the experience that comes with that win, experience that can not be obtained from playing just two days against the best players in the world.

I am no longer a Wie backer as I got tired of watching her missing putts; but why do those who do not support her decision (to follow an odd route) behave a little more cordial in these forums? It is just a game after all. Actually, if it weren't for Michelle Wie, I doubt Morgan Pressell would have gotten a good contract like the one she got from Callaway. When Michelle plays, ratings go up; and more sponsors notice the other LPGA players that Michelle plays against, and then are willing to dish out more money. What is wrong with publicity since everyone wins?
The question is why is there such a big camp of Wie supporters? First of all, she is photogenic, likable, tall, and is a good communicator in camera? I dare anyone mention another female golfer who is as likable (pleasing to watch both in looks and when swinging than Michelle). Secondly, because we are Americans we like to think BIG. Many people when they see a girl that can drive the ball 300 yards; and has one of the best swings (or at least picture perfect) in golf; one immediately thinks that she has enormous potential. Under the right tutelage/direction she could become such person: she could transcend golf/ cross gender lines, etc. That is like hoping that one's daughter becomes the US president; and not just a mayor or senator. That is what is all about: she has the potential to be huge and that is what drives the marketing hype. This does not mean that she will ever reach that level at anytime, and I seriously doubt that she will; but many people naturally like to dream big; so I think it's best to just let it play out as it is; let Michelle and her backers dream, and sooner or later the facts will come up in the next three years based on results; and either they will wake up from their dreams; or perhaps keep on dreaming if she does well.

I am not anti Wie; but I am not pro either. So for those anti-Wie folks, I suggest to cool it and let others have their dream in the meantime.

hc2--What a beautiful post about believing in yourself and being allowed to follow your dreams, after all if you do not dream big for yourself nobody else will. Only one problem, coming from you it seams a bit insincere, after all you are the guy who spent all of Chris Baldwins last blog writing about, "how sick and tired you were of her playing with the men" and how she was not learning anything from it and just, "wasting her time". You also echoed the sentiment of the, "Wie bashers" you take to task in this post by saying that she hasn't learned to win and would be better served playing in, "Korean, European or Japanese women's tour events, or the future's tour, rather then men's events." So much for following that dream. You even say that with all influx of new young talent on the LPGA tour she is in danger of becoming a routine player, hey you're starting to sound like all those mean ol'e Wie bashers. So what is it hc2 are you just pandering now to the Wie fans who cry foul when anybody dares criticize a 16 year-old girl or are you just the hypocrite you appear to be. Don't tell me to cool it and don't preach to me about letting people dream out of one side of you're mouth while you take shots at her out of the other.

Jackson said: 'So what is it hc2 are you just pandering now to the Wie fans who cry foul when anybody dares criticize a 16 year-old girl..?'
--
If you reread my posts that I had made on all those key points, I never crossed the line and tried to offend anyone who did not necessarily agree with me (that she actually is not learning to deal with pressure while competing with the men nor even with the LPGA women.) Whenever I try to make a point with someone I try to avoid name calling. I call it civility, you call it being hypocritical, and you may have a point.
But that is one of the beauty of this debate: it is not that simple and straight forward. I agree with all the Anti-Wie points that you referred to; I also go on say that she, and her parents have no clue to the experience that she is missing: going to sleep on Saturdays with a lead or co-lead, back nine pressure in final round, converting clutch putts, winning by one shot, winning by a dozen; developing feel, scrambling. It's either they don't know the value of these situations, or they don't care. If you think about it, maybe Michelle Wie at this point in life is not interested in winning tournaments and is perfectly happy having her dreams (and telling the world about them), traveling the world, getting millions, fame, fashion, shopping. My suspicion is that it's a typical teenager phase where she is having these wild fantasies and as she grows up in the next couple of years she will learn to realize that succeeding in golf is not that simple after all.
A final point is that by criticizing Wie, Chris Baldwin and the chorus line of Wie critics are actually the ones that are doing Michelle Wie the big favor that she wake up from her fantasies, and instead use a different approach in her development. Her parents are spoiling her in my view, they are not doing their job of telling her 'no' when it needs be. They are just following her to fantasyland, when they should be instilling the values of winning and beating the crap out of everyone in the golf course. That is the philosophy that she should be taught ala Tiger. My take is that her philosophy is 'I am pretty girl having a stroll in the park, who is stylish, and smiles a lot; and has big drives which must count more than four foot putts; and since I have a beautiful swing I must get some style points for that. Also, I must be doing well with my 300 yard drives and my good looking swerving iron shots.' These I suspect are her fallacies in thoughts. But should one stop her from dreaming big? Let her live and learn from her own mistakes. Sooner than later the fame/attention will dry out. Now that Mina Harigae is really something.. you guys should check her out..

hc2

You are wrong on your facts. Michelle Wie did go to sleep on Saturday(assuming she went to sleep) with a co-lead in the 2005 US Woemen's Open.

Let us establish ground rules for comparing LPGA performance for 2006 involving Michelle Wie and full time LPGA pros. But it is hardly fair to compare total wins or total money when one player can only play 8 events.

SUGGESTION

3 competitions. best 2 out of 3--but a split decision is not a decisive victory.

1) Winning percentage. Wins divided by LPGA tournaments played.

2) Pro-rated Rolex Player of the Year points. We credit Wie with the points she would have gotten as an LPGA member. Divide by tournaments played(Majors count double since you get double points for Majors). For example, last year we would divide by 8+4=12 for Wie,and 25+4=29 for Creamer.

3)Money earned in Majors plus the Evian Masters. We will exclude the Evian if Wie chooses not to play there this year.

hc2

I would like to express the view that Wie's preparation is close to ideal.

Annika won 10 out of 20 tournaments last year. I am sure Wie's goal for the LPGA would involve that level of performance. 4 top 3s out of 8 last year for Michelle seem closer to that goal than one win and a bunch of low finishes would have been.

The biggest weakness in her game seems to be her putting. Part of that is probably the result of living in Hawaii without the range of grass types she might see elsewhere. In any case, there seems no reason why a 16 year old girl can't improve her putting if that is the weakest part of her game.

If Michelle Wie can finish as high as she can when she seems to leave a lot of strokes out there on the course, just think of what she might do when she plays up to her potential.

A Michelle Wie fan wants to include win percentage in his satistical analysis. That might be a first, considering that her career win percentage stands at 0%. I'm not interested in games to compare who has the better year, in fact I don't care who is better between Michelle and Paula. If I were a Michelle Wie fan I would care about one thing and one thing only and that is winning a tournament, not making cuts in men's events, not piling up top tens, but winning and winning alone. All she has to do is win to silence her critics and prove that she has what it takes to get the job done. We all know she has the talent, but does she have "it".

Jackson said:
So winning a "poor" event isn't that big a deal now Norman. Someone who has defended Michelle Wie's record by offering up such titles as the Jennie K. Wilson and the Women's Publinx is now saying that winning a co-sactioned women's pro tournament is no big deal.
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What exactly do you know about the Ladies European Tour?
I know some of the players and I can tell you that the standard is pretty bad. It is not some sort of equivalent of what the mens is at. All of the best lady european players play on the lpga tour.
That is why there are so many captains picks when the European team is being selected.

As for the Australian Ladies Tour, I don't know alot about it, but it probably in a worse situation.

Of course Amy Yang deserves praise for her win. But calling her the new Michelle Wie, as many articles have, is blowing her success out of proportion.

When she plays the lpga, you can judge where her level really is.

Jackson said:
As I have suspected all along you and the rest of the Wie apologists don't really care about wins, you like Wie care about media coverage and money.

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You are half right. I'm not particularly bothered by her winning at this time.
That would be very different if she were playing a full lpga season. In that case it would be very important to me that she would win.

As she is only playing in a limited number of lpga events, I am not overly expectant of her winning, because she has so few chances to do so.
I am much more concerned with the level of her play. If she plays the 8 lpga tournaments and does not win, but shows improvement in her game then I will be happy.

You place too much emphasis on titles. Titles are important as you mature, but at her age she should just try to improve as much as she can.

hc2 said:
Secondly, because we are Americans we like to think BIG.
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We are not all Americans. Some of us are from places that easily beat American Ryder Cup teams.

hc2 said:
I also go on say that she, and her parents have no clue to the experience that she is missing: going to sleep on Saturdays with a lead or co-lead, back nine pressure in final round, converting clutch putts, winning by one shot, winning by a dozen; developing feel, scrambling.
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Michelle Wie finished in the top 3 of half the lpga events she entered last season. Obviously she is good enough to compete for lpga titles.
Therefore she is obviously going to get plenty of experience in those situations coming down the stretch.

You suggest that she should play weak womens events instead of playing in mens events, lets go through some facts:
* She has 8 lpga exemptions. She doesn't have much left over after that.
* She will probably play 2 pga events, and maybe 2 foreign mens events, The Telecom and The Casio.

What does she gain from these mens events?
- experience against the best in the world on the pga tour.
- experience against high quality male players in the foreign events, and extra experience of longer mens courses that she would not get on womens courses.

If she were to take your suggesting of playing in womens foreign events:
- lack of experience on mens courses which would seriously undermine her chances of improving her game to make her stated goal of a pga tour card.
- a better chance of winning very minor tournaments.

If she were to win one of these minor tournaments, you claim that, that would help her winning ability.
- From personal experience, I can tell you that winning at a certain level does absolutely nothing to help you achieve winning at a higher level.
I could list off tonnes of half bit titles that I have won at various levels, but from my experience, that does not stand to you on the next stage. The process just begins all over again.

For Michelle it is an obvious and a simple and intelligent decision for her to play only on the lpga as regards her womens tournaments.
That would be very different if she were struggling to compete, but she is not. She is doing very well and has been very close to success there. If she were to win some token title somewhere else it would not benefit her lpga chances, because she would still have to come back and beat stiffer competition.
I hope my points are getting through.

Jim Coulthard said:
SUGGESTION

1) Winning percentage. Wins divided by LPGA tournaments played.
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I wouldn't support that. If someone won 1 from 25, it wouldn't prove that they were better than someone who won 0 from 8.

A fairer system is head to heads in tournaments they played together. Whoever finishes ahead of the other more times wins.

I think Michelle Wie has a very good chance to win this year--this month, in particular. But I agree improvement in her game at this stage is more important than an occassional win. I only include wins in the mix because it seems so important to Wie critics, and at least I want them to be pro-rated and included in a mix with other measures. Over the long run her ladies game will be judged by LPGA wins--and LPGA Major wins. But sacrificing long term development for an occassional win at this point--particularly at a lower level--would seem pointless.

There is a tennis equivalent of what Michelle Wie is doing. I am talking about the Williams sisters. As teens, they were not the best teenagers in the world--they were still developing their power game while others teens' more polished games may have netted more wins. But in the twenties, Serena certainly became one of the most dominating players ever.

If Michelle Wie is trying to develop a game that is more like a man's--then it stands to reason that it might take longer for her game to mature than it does for most women. EVEN if she were the same age as Paula Creamer, her potential would be enough to make many people very excited about her prospects. WHAT IS SO WRONG IF MICHELLE WIE HAS FANS WHO ARE EXCITED ABOUT A 16 YEAR OLD WHO HAS YET TO WIN AT A LEVEL WHERE NO 16 OR 17 YEAR OLD HAS EVER WON?

Mina Harigae is 20 days younger than Wie. According to the article, her most impressive achievement seems to be losing a 2nd round match to Morgan Pressel at last year Women's amateur--but putting in a good effort, matching Pressel with a 67 before losing with a bogey on the 19th hole. Supposedly she has what it takes to be number 1, and I am sure Annika is quaking in her boots.

hc2, if Mina Harigae is your idol, then you really shouldn't be taking pot shots at Wie fans.

A little more about Mina:
-She burst out in the scene five years ago by winning the California Women's Amateur when she was 11 by defeating her best friend/playing companion Sydney Burlison. She then went on to win the next four California Women's Amateur.
-Mina is currently the no. 1 ranked US girls junior in golfweek. This ranking is based on head to head against top 25, top 50 juniors, etc. She plays strictly Junior events, and if she played college events I would say she would be top 1 or top 2 ranked for sure in the Women's Amateur ranks.
-She comes from the same breed as Paula Creamer, and Morgan Pressell. She learned to watch how Paula and Morgan dominated in the Junior ranks, and although she did not have any major wins against them, she learned what it takes to win; and to hate losing. Basically, she has the same pitbull, winning mentality as Morgan and Paula.
-She appeared in the Golf Channel to showcase her bionic swing after winning the California Women's Amateur. How could I describe it? Textbook, superb at impact and follow through.
-The main weakness of her was: 'she has excellent touch, can scramble like mad, great iron shots within 120-140 range, but.. she is too small!!' That was because she was 4 ft. 11 (95 lbs) when she was 12. She has now grown to 5'4 ft. 116 lbs. and is now a handsome young woman. Before she could only drive it 225-235 yards, now due to Pilates/strengthening program she made a dramatic leap in her driving to 270. Thanks God for Mr. Pilates and for coming up with those core strengthening exercises.
-I think the American public will find Mina as appealing, and will love her, if not more than Michelle Wie. Mina is low key, and at the tender age of 12 already talked about her responsiblity that she shouldered in being a role model to even younger kids who were taking up golf. She has been very active with the First Tee program in Monterey. She does not have the 'I am too good' attitude, and has willingly played High School Golf when everyone knows she is overqualified. She is as feisty/competitive as Morgan, while at the same time knowing when keeping silent is best.
-I like Mina's chances more than Michelle, because in my view Golf is a game of touch, creativity, strong will,and scrambling; and those are Mina's strength.
I know that this post is probably 1 year too early, since she has not had her 'come out' party yet. She has not received exemptions to LPGA events yet.
A couple of years from now, I expect we will all be saying; what did you say? Michelle...who?

hc2 said:
She comes from the same breed as Paula Creamer, and Morgan Pressell. She learned to watch how Paula and Morgan dominated in the Junior ranks, and although she did not have any major wins against them, she learned what it takes to win; and to hate losing. Basically, she has the same pitbull, winning mentality as Morgan and Paula.
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If a young tennis player comes along and wins lots of junior events and has alot of junior tournaments wins and successes, does that mean that he will come along and beat Roger Federer and take grand slam titles?
No it does not.

The same applies here.

You can have all the winning mentality that you want, but if you are not good enough, it won't be of any help to you.

I do have to commend you for at least naming an alternative to Wie. Most Wie-bashers do just that, and don't provide anyone who they think is or will be better.

hc2 said:
She does not have the 'I am too good' attitude, and has willingly played High School Golf when everyone knows she is overqualified.
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Or could it be that she is too afraid to try out at a higher level or that she knows she isn't good enough.

Playing against kids doesn't show courage as you suggest, it merely shows that she thinks she isn't good enough for the big time yet.

hc2, 5 ft 4 is still a midget in my book. Just wait a few years. Mina Harigae or whatever her name is will be trying to put on 20 pounds like so many small to mid sized LPGA players. I tell you LPGA is a breeding ground for fat ones. They want to be fat! So much for the sex appeal. I bet Pressel will gain 20 more pounds too.

Playing against kids when you are a kid and have everything to lose and nothing to gain does show courage Norman. When you are expected to win you must win, second place is not good enough when you are the overwhelming favorite. Michelle Wie has showed a different type of courage by testing her skills against the very best in the world, she was risking a lot and at least on the LPGA level she has proven that she belongs, she has not won yet, but nobody would say she can not compete. Against the men she also showed a type of courage, she could have truly emberrased herself out there and she did not, she's not ready to truly challenge the men, but she has guts giving it a try. it is important to reember that she does not have the pressure to win or even make cuts in these events so she does not have to show that much courage in that regard. Both girls should be comemmded for their play and for their different approaches, just teeing it up and competing shows courage lets not forget that.

This Mina girl is not showing courage or cowardise in the level she is competing at.

She is competing at that level because that is the only level that she allowed too.
Only very few of the very talented girls like Wie and Creamer get offered lpga exemptions.
I suspect that if Mina was offered an lpga exemption she would take it.

If she is that good, she will be playing on the lpga soon enough anyway and then people can judge her versus Wie.
One thing is for sure, she isn't better than Wie, just because she won a few amateur titles.

Johnny--I was trying to be nice, but I'm going to let you in on a little secret Michelle Wie and her father are the biggest cowards on the planet because she ran away from playing against her peers, reason being that she would rather lose to who she was supposed to lose to then beat who she was supposed to beat. I know you and the all the Wie losers don't want to hear this, but it's true. You will argue that she wanted to play the best competition she could and that travel costs were to high or whatever, but the truth is she has been marketed as a trailblazer and getting her ass kicked by girls her own age, would not set her apart. The only way Michelle Wie sets herself apart from the other teen stars(all of whom have more distinguished amateur and career records) is to play with the men, an endeavor which has proved to be a failure on every level(0-8 playing in PGA, Asian, Nationwide events) what's next the all-boys 10-under city championships. You can tout all her top fives if you want, but sooner or later she is going to have to prove she can win a golf tournament and that's one thing Nike, Sony, her dad and all the hype in the world won't help her with. She's smoke and mirrors, big hitting and no putting, all sugar and smiles, with no heart.

Trip,
Sorry but you are wrong.
I also want to apologise to any of the other people who comment here because much of what I have to say has come from them, because I have read the arguments and decided based on that what the reality of the situation is.

POINT NUMBER 1
Comparing amateur to professional tournaments is like chalk and cheese.
If somebody is good enough at golf they will achieve at the highest level. Spouting out lists of amateur successes doesn't impress me.
If those people who have great amateur success go on to achieve at the professional level, then they will be truly successful. However, achieving at the amateur level isn't worth that much.
Tiger achieved at the amateur level. Had he not been so successful on the professional level, would anyone have cared about his amateur successes? Would they have said he was a great player? I think not.

POINT NUMBER 2
Michelle Wie has tried to play at the highest level possible. You may not agree with her choice, but that is her choice and it doesn't mean that she is afraid of anything.
On the contrary, if she were to have concentrated on these lesser events, she could have won some and lost plenty, and not have had the pressure because she would not have been in the spotlight.
Instead, she has decided to play against the best players, and test where her ability is at versus theirs and try to learn from them and improve her game. This has given her increased exposure and has shown that she is infact very brave in her decisions. If she played the youngsters that would have been the easy route.
Instead she has broke equalled par or better in 4 rounds out of 8 in pga tournaments.

POINT NUMBER 3
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Trip said: "The only way Michelle Wie sets herself apart from the other teen stars(all of whom have more distinguished amateur and career records) is to play with the men, an endeavor which has proved to be a failure on every level(0-8 playing in PGA, Asian, Nationwide events) what's next the all-boys 10-under city championships. "
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Trip, who out of these teen stars with their distinguished amateur records could shoot 68 in a pga event?
Another thing is, that none of those attempts have been failures.
It was said that the Nationwide and Canadian events were takent at a time when she wasn't even able to make lpga cuts, so you can leave those out for a start.
In the other 6 attempts, she has been very close to making the cut, within 2 shots in 3 of those. What other of these distinguished girls could do this?

POINT NUMBER 4
Saying that she has no heart is pure rubbish. After the Sony first round, it was said that she went out on the range to practice for hours on end, hitting ball after ball after ball. If that doesn't suggest heart to you, then you are very misguided by your resentment.
Also, when she had a poor first round and then hit 3 straight bogeys in her 2nd round, it would have been very easy to claim a sicky (SHANKS HAD A STORY ABOUT THAT A WHILE AGO). But Michelle persevered and got her round back together, and actually scored the 12th best round of the day, in a field of 140 or more top class men.
That shows that she has heart and also the talent.

It is no wonder that she has so many dedicated fans, when she has such great characteristics.

When I stated:
SHANKS HAD A STORY ABOUT THAT A WHILE AGO
I meant a story in relation to John Daly walking out on a tournament.

Last year Morgan Pressel lost in the 3rd round of the USGA Junior Girls--and hardly anyone noticed. There is no courage involved in competing in events where you are expected to win if no one is going to notice when you don't. What about Annika? She was supposed to win the 3rd leg of the grand slam, but when she didn't no one noticed. All they could talk about was the poor performance of a 15 year old amateur who tied Annika for 23rd place.
Indeed, I am not aware of any female golfer other than Michelle Wie who is ever criticised for poor performance--except when Wie defenders are trying to point out this double standard. Look at the ANZ Masters. The news was Amy Yang's win--not Karrie Webb's poor performance. Indeed, on travel golf it seems like the person who came in for the most criticism beacuse of the results in the ANZ Masters was not anyone who was there--but Michelle Wie, because Amy Yang has a pro win and Michelle Wie dioesn't. At least wait until later this month when Michelle has a chance to play in her first LPGA event of the year.

David wrote: "In short, she's too busy trying to beat the men when she hasn't even beaten the women yet!

David - Michelle is NOT trying to beat the men! She is simply trying to become the youngest, and first in over 60 years to make a PGA CUT!

As far as beating the women on the LPGA tour - THAT could very well happen this week whwn she wins the Fields Open on her home course in Honolulu!