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88 comments

Comment from: John Z [Visitor]
Extra! Extra! Read all about it! Michelle Wie finishes THIRD! Sweeps into first in Rolex rankings! Euphoria engulfs Wie Warriors! One-Putt, Jim COULThard, Wayne and alan arrested for rioting in defiance of martial law and curfew! Norman, Grand Dragon of the Wie Warriors, announces plans to file suit against Augusta National and Masters' Committee to force them to issue an invitation to Miss Wie. In a hastily called press conference, Norman, a noted professional himself stated,"Michelle's stellar performance in trouncing the field at the Fields should give notice to the reactionary members of the committee that their 19th century plantation mentality has no place in modern golfdom. Miss Wie has earned her rightful place beside Messrs. Jones, Sarazen, Nicklaus, Palmer, Snead, Nelson and Woods."
02/26/06 @ 09:38
Comment from: Under Par [Visitor]
So, in other words, Bubbles once again couldn't rise to the occasion.
02/26/06 @ 10:01
Comment from: Under Par [Visitor]
My, my, some might actually start to think that Bubbles was psychologically fragile.
02/26/06 @ 10:10
Comment from: Steve [Visitor]
Under Par,
Quit being a hater...

She was six strokes back and had the lead when she finished her round.

She had no control over what the Lee girls would do after her.

I'm sure youconveniently forgot about Creamer's mediocre performance for being a #2 player---and Morgan's bogey-bogey finish..

That amateur experience really helped them there
02/26/06 @ 10:12
Comment from: Jim [Visitor]
Psychologically fragile ??

Pressel and Wie were both in the same position going into the final round...

One rallied from six shots back to get the lead- and finished third --1 shot back from the lead.

The other bogeyed the last 2 holes and finished 11th....

Now who's psychologically fragile again ?
02/26/06 @ 10:18
Comment from: John Z [Visitor]
Jnder Par, well I guess you got your comeuppance already. Just wait until Norman gets on your case! YOU will be psychologically fragile! When the REAL Wie Warriors come on this thread, you and all the other haters will be in flames. To these guys, Michelle will NEVER have to win anything. By finishing THIRD on her home course in a field that did not include the world's best, she has PROVED conclusively that she belongs in the Hall of Fame right now.
02/26/06 @ 10:39
Comment from: jon [Visitor]
Sorry, John Z and Under Par. Not biting the bait today. Not gonna argue with morons today, lol. Get your attention seeking fix somewhere else. I think I will just enjoy MIchelle Wie's great third round finish tieing the leader, as she sailed away in company of her adoring fans. Have a great day --- if you can.
02/26/06 @ 10:47
Comment from: David [Visitor]
Michelle Wie is.

The fact that her trophy cabinet is empty probably doesn't help much.

And to piss of a few Wie fanatics - Paula is a better player who has actually proven she can win. She doesn't have $10 million in endorsement deals, but hey, she's no Kournikova.
02/26/06 @ 10:52
Comment from: jon [Visitor]
Yawn ----
02/26/06 @ 11:01
Comment from: John Z [Visitor]
jon, I'm sorry to hear that you're out of the loop. Under Par and I will just have to wait for some of the big guns among the Wie Warriors to come out to play. I thought you'd be happy that Michelle emerged victorious with her third place finish. Why then do you call us morons? It's not PC to denigrate the intellectually challenged.
02/26/06 @ 11:11
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
John Z said:
Norman, Grand Dragon of the Wie Warriors, announces plans to file suit against Augusta National and Masters' Committee to force them to issue an invitation to Miss Wie.
******************************

Actually I have stated on a number of occasions that I don't think Michelle should get invited to any mens majors without qualifying for them.
I have also said that if she were invited, not only would it be bad for the game, but it would be bad for her because she just isn't good enough as of yet.
02/26/06 @ 11:21
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
Under Par said:
My, my, some might actually start to think that Bubbles was psychologically fragile.
*************************

You obviously didn't watch the event.
If you had, you would know that she made an excellent clutch birdie putt on hole 17.
When she finished her round, she took the lead and it may have been good enough to take the title, but it was out of her hands at that stage.

If you want to talk about psychologically fragile people, perhaps you could mention the performances of Pressel, Guilbis, Ochoa and others.

Wie's performance was outstanding once again.
02/26/06 @ 11:24
Comment from: John Z [Visitor]
Under Par, That's it then. Norman, now elevated to the position of Imperial Wizard of the Wie Warriors, has spoken. Michelle's third place is "outstanding." End of story. I can't understand why she didn't make another clutch putt on eighteen. Another thing that escapes me is this: Norman said that Michelle's performance was outstanding "once again." When were her other outstanding performances? Does anybody know?
02/26/06 @ 11:45
Comment from: Jake [Visitor]

David --where did Creamer finish again ??
02/26/06 @ 11:45
Comment from: Kyle [Visitor]
David
Yes Creamer has her 4 wins...

BUT--
Only 1 of them came when Wie and Annika were playing in the same tournament --the others were very weak fields...(especially the 2 she won in Japan)

Head to Head --
Michelle Wie has finished ahead of Creamer more times than Creamer has finished ahead of Wie.

02/26/06 @ 11:49
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Kudos for placeing the focus of your post on the gang-buster performance of Meena Lee who didn't even make the Golf Channel radar until she was two holes from the end of the round. She crafted a masterpiece and deserves far more credit than she is getting.

Props likewise for pointing out that it was not the 18th hole that cost Michelle the tournament, but the 13th where she went par for the tournament and should have played at around -2. Those two shots cost her the out-right win.

Why her ball had an utter fascination with the left rough has never been explained by anybody. You could cover her lies from all three rounds with a small beach blanket even though it was obviously not where she intended to go on any of the three drives.

The Golf Channel broke her swing down in slo-mo for both the 2nd and 3rd rounds and the only thing they could come up with was that she seemed to be firing her right hand too early. A puzzlement indeed. But that hole is where she lost it.
02/26/06 @ 11:59
Comment from: Kyle [Visitor]

The only choke jobs that day were Pressel, Ochoa, and Gulbis.

Michelle played great and didn't falter in the end as she has a tendency to do but actually raised her game.

Sometimes you do all the right things, play the best you can and still lose.

That happens...

Michelle will be fine --she will continue to get better.
02/26/06 @ 12:15
Comment from: Young [Visitor]
Psychologically fragile?

Are you talking about the Pressel's crying jag after she finished behind Wie?

02/26/06 @ 13:23
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
OK JOHN Z once and for all they are ALL KIDS we are discussing here. For their ages they play some pretty damned good golf.

Paula Creamer is 18 (the on;y legal adult out of the bunch) and has a better start this year than last. She has improved. It may not look like it with your narrow perspective on life, but she has.

Morgan Pressel is 17 and has an outstanding start to her season as a rookie on the LPGA tour.

Michelle Wie is 16 and finished 3rd in her first LPGA start of the season. I would call this exceptional, considering how far she was off the lead at the start of the day.

Now John don't let your own failures in life cloud your mind, Think back those many years ago when you were 16, 17 or 18 and tell the forum what you accomplished in the world of professional sports at those ages.

John my expectations from children are not as high as yours and I appreciate when they give everything they have in an event.

There are professionals John who can help you deal with these problems you have and I encourage you to seek out their help before you go over the edge.
02/26/06 @ 13:24
Comment from: Wayne [Visitor]
Kyle, here's the head-to-head update:

Wie's 6 tops Creamer's 3. Does this mean that Wie will always be twice as good as Creamer?

I read somewhere that Wie would have been ranked higher than Creamer already on the Rolex's Women World Rankings had it not been for the unusually high points one gets for playing in the JLPGA. And as Kyle pointed out, Creamer won two tournaments over in Japan.
02/26/06 @ 14:03
Comment from: John Z [Visitor]
One-Putt, Geez, I thought that you were just the up-and-coming resident Wie sycophant, one step below Norman in brown-nosing. Now you're dispensing psychiatric advice. My advice to you is "Physician, heal thyself."
02/26/06 @ 14:38
Comment from: Jim COULTHARD [Visitor]
It is not only the JLPGA events that help Paula Creamer. She is also helped by the fact that she played only 7 events in 2004, but 27 in 2005. The older event get reduced points, but each one still counts as one tournament when we determine the devisor. Newcomers get this rankings boost. At the end of this year it will be players like Morgan Pressel who enjoy the same advantage Paula Creamer does now--unless the rule is changed.
02/26/06 @ 14:47
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
One-Putt said:
Now John don't let your own failures in life cloud your mind, Think back those many years ago when you were 16, 17 or 18
*************************

I think you are asking a bit much of a 75 year old guy. Fifty might be more manageable.
02/26/06 @ 15:10
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
John Z said:
I can't understand why she didn't make another clutch putt on eighteen. Another thing that escapes me is this: Norman said that Michelle's performance was outstanding "once again." When were her other outstanding performances? Does anybody know?
******************************

That was a two part question.
On the first part, she putted well enough, not to three putt on the 18th hole, and a three-putt was very possible in that situation, if she really went all out for it.
Instead she left herself a tap in and a very realistic chance of winning.
Monty did the same thing a month or two ago, and his opponent double bogied the last, and Monty won.

On the other question, where were her other outstanding performances:
- quarter final of US Amateur Mens Publinx, the first female to qualify for any male adult usga event, and then got to the last eight in the event.
- winner of the US Womens Amateur Publinx. The youngest winner of this event.
- 2nd place in the lpga championship, a womens major.
- 3rd place in the Women's British Open, a womens major, and the winner of the gold medal there for top amateur.
- 4th place at the Kraft Nabisco, a womens major, as a 14 year old girl.
- youngest ever qualifier for an lpga tournament.
- multiple good rounds on pga courses, which is outstanding because no other woman has done it or, in my opinion, would be capable of it.
02/26/06 @ 15:19
Comment from: John Z [Visitor]
One-Putt, you seem to have a one-track mind about everything and everyone with whom you disagree. It's always something along the lines of "you really need therapy", presumably psychotherapy. You even said that darling Michelle might need therapy. Now, I'm just a retired construction tradesman(ironworker),living here in "flyover country." Hereabouts, we're plain folk who don't cotton to such high-sounding nonsense. But then I re-read some of your posts and came upon something which explains everything. You are from Southern California, the land of fruits and nuts. That alone accounts for all your bizarre notions.
02/26/06 @ 15:27
Comment from: David [Visitor]
>> David --where did Creamer finish again ??

Behind Wie. Yes, Jake, that means Michelle is better than Paula, in the same way that one tournament should determine the order of the Women's World Rankings (as Jennifer explained masterfully).

---------------------
David
Yes Creamer has her 4 wins...

BUT--
Only 1 of them came when Wie and Annika were playing in the same tournament --the others were very weak fields...(especially the 2 she won in Japan)

Head to Head --
Michelle Wie has finished ahead of Creamer more times than Creamer has finished ahead of Wie.
---------------------

Yes, 4 wins. How many does the Winless Wonder have? (I left a subtle hint for you.)

And I couldn't give a rat's ass whether Annika was in the field or not. It doesm't say on the trophy:

'Winner 2005: Paula Creamer (note: field did not contain Annika Sorenstam)'

Besides, her Evian Masters win showed that Paula can beat anyone in the world of women's golf. She was 8 strokes ahead of the nearest competitor, and 18 strokes in front of Annika. The Evian is probably the biggest women's golf tournament in Europe, except for the Women's British Open (which not so long ago was a complete flop).

I also don't care about 'head-to-heads' that don't result in one of the players winning the tournament. Going head-to-head with someone for 67th place ain't exactly a pressureful situation. Michelle still hasn't won anything. I couldn't give a shit whether Michelle has finished ahead of Paula in a billion tournaments.. I just don't care.

Oh, and I believe Paula is actually 19 now.
02/26/06 @ 16:27
Comment from: Ron Mon [Member] Email
All right, Angry David. Let's stop using our curse-laden vocabulary to make a point. You dropped the A word and the S word darned near in succession. Remember, this is a gentle-person's sport/game, and we are all gentle-persons.
02/26/06 @ 16:31
Comment from: Under Par [Visitor]
Ahh, how typical of the intellectually vacuous. Do you perhaps feel as if you can't refute substantively what John, David and I have said? Is that why you point to the faltering of Pressel and Creamer to defend Bubbles?

Here's a quick lesson in logic: evidence indicating that other players may be psychologically fragile does nothing to prove that Bubbles is not. Anyway, you seem to want to play tit-for-tat, so you transform me into one of those ladies' cornermen, but I'm not playing. I never said that I was a fan of either of them; I have no horse in this race.

The bottom line is this: if I said definitively that Bubbles will never be a clutch competitor, I'd be less than intellectually honest. However, if you say that she isn't exhibiting a pattern that indicates she MIGHT not be, you aren't being intellectually honest.

And, yes, John, it's amazing how the Wiemen will rationalize away the quite mortal performances of their demi-goddess.
02/26/06 @ 17:20
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
UnderPar, I fear that your attempt at presenting logic to a Wie apologist is an exercise in futility. Logic to a Wieman is like garlic to a vampire. A dyslexic person will understand "Ulysses" before a Wie Warrior will comprehend logic.
02/26/06 @ 17:59
Comment from: Under Par [Visitor]
True, Alex, and splendidly put.
02/26/06 @ 18:21
Comment from: David [Visitor]
Okay, sorry for the bad language.
02/26/06 @ 18:44
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Under Par,

When adopting the guise of an intellectual, it might be prudent of you to recall that "intellectually" is an adverb and "vacuous" is an adjective. Did you perhaps mean "...typical of the intellectually ungifted?" In which case the adverb would modify a verb.

And in the same line of argument:

Alex,

You have misconstrued dyslexia as an inability to understand complex topics. Dyslexia is in fact the inability to comprehend WRITTEN matter. Dyslexics have no difficulty comprehending SPOKEN material and are, as a matter of fact, frequently superior in oral comprehension as an acquired compensation for their reading disability. Hence your statement should more correctly be:
"A dyslexic person will READ AND understand "Ulysses" before a Wie Warrior will comprehend logic."

Further, in your phrase "comprehend logic" you personify the abstract noun "logic" which requires that logic be capitalized, hence "comprehend Logic."

But then, I ain't no stinkin' intellectual, so I understood what you meant, and found it laughable.

Thanks for the chuckle, now can we get back to Golf?
02/26/06 @ 20:51
Comment from: Under Par [Visitor]
John, the phrase "intellectually vacuous" is absolutely correct. A synonym of vacuous is "empty"; thus, the phrase means intellectually empty. Go back to English class.
02/26/06 @ 21:06
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Under Par,

Hie thee to an English class thyself...while "empty" in one of its usages has a verb form amenable to an adverbial modifier, it also has an adverbial form. This is the form which is the synonym for "vacuous".

Vacuous has no corresponding verb form. Therefore "...intellectually empty..." might be a proper usage in some circumstances such as "you must intellectually empty your mind to make room for a new concept." However, "intellectually vacuous" is not proper in any circumstance.

Incidentally, when the entire clause is intended to replace a noun or pronoun as you attempt to use it above, "intellectually empty" also constitutes an improper usage.
02/26/06 @ 21:24
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
John Neal, In case you didn't know, "Ulysses"is a novel, a book, WRITTEN material, which of course a dyslexic person would not be able to comprehend. Most people who are not dyslexic have difficulty understanding that book. In any case, that bit of picturesque exaggeration is not germane to discussion. If you want to criticize usage, syntax and grammar,try some of the Wie Warriors on this board. They'd make Norm Crosby sound like William Buckley.
02/26/06 @ 21:32
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
John Neal, I re-read several of your post in which I noticed many grammatical errors. The most egregious was the use of the mongrel expression "alright". Now, for a run-of-the-mill Wie Warrior, I would probably let such a minor infraction slide. But since you have appointed yourself an arbiter of usage and grammar, I must tell you that in the English language "all right" is, and always has been, TWO SEPARATE WORDS!
02/26/06 @ 21:45
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
John Neal, when you state that an adverb cannot modify an adjective, you are quite simply incorrect. An example of that function of the adverb is present in my preceding sentence. Simply, the adverb, modifies the adjective, incorrect. John Neal, you sir have been quite simply OWNED!
02/26/06 @ 21:53
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Alex, in case you didn't know it, "Ulysses" is a work of literature. In one of its forms it is a book and must be read. In another of its forms it is a tape recording and must be heard.

A dyslexic person is probably more likely to comprehend the tape recording than a non-dyslexic. We non-dyslexics rarely have the attention span to carry Joyce's stream of consciousness narratives to their conclusions when hearing them in oral form i.e. in the oral media it is we who are handicapped not they.

I have no intentions of critizing other blogger's usage, syntax and grammer. This is after all a colloquial English venue. I just object to the adoption of a cloak of intellectual superiority when the cloak is poorly fitted and worn inside out.
02/26/06 @ 21:56
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Alex,

Quoth the Merriam-Webster online dictionary:
"ALL RIGHT
usage:
The one-word spelling alright appeared some 75 years after all right itself had reappeared from a 400-year-long absence. Since the early 20th century some critics have insisted alright is wrong, but it has its defenders and its users. It is less frequent than all right but remains in common use especially in journalistic and business publications. It is quite common in fictional dialogue, and is used occasionally in other writing . "

02/26/06 @ 22:03
Comment from: Brian J [Visitor]
Alex,

"The one-word spelling alright appeared some 75 years after all right itself had reappeared from a 400-year-long absence.

Since the early 20th century some critics have insisted alright is wrong, but it has its defenders and its users.

It is less frequent than all right but remains in common use especially in journalistic and business publications.

It is quite common in fictional dialogue, and is used occasionally in other writing ."
02/26/06 @ 22:17
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Absolutely the last post I will make on this thread of conversation.

Alex,

The phrase you chose as an example is also an incorrect usage. You have an adjective which modifies nothing. In your opinion, I was, simply speaking, incorrect in my interpretation of English grammer.

And that ends my discussion. I hope that in the mirror of my pretentious commentary (and I was most intentionally being pretentious) you are able to see how ill received your commentary has been.

From here on out, I fully intend to post in common everyday English with all of its foibles and failings.

This is a Golf post, and lets keep it to that.
02/26/06 @ 22:17
Comment from: Brian J [Visitor]
John Neal,

Sorry. I didn't see your comment when I posted mine.

I think everyone on this post must have made a grammatical error or two.

So let's put all these behind and talk about golf.
02/26/06 @ 22:24
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Brian,

No Problema! And thanks for covering my back.

Now just help me figure out what we are going to use to fill the thirty day gap until Michelle plays again. According to some, We will have nothing else to do :-)
02/26/06 @ 22:29
Comment from: Brian J [Visitor]
I am a fan of Wie and very disappointed that Wie didn't win at the Fields Open.

I hoped that she had won. I thought she had a great chance this time.

I hope she would win next time.
02/26/06 @ 22:34
Comment from: Under Par [Visitor]
John,

Sometimes adverbs modify adjectives or other adverbs. Would you like to bet money on this?
02/26/06 @ 22:47
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Under Par, Sorry, I have sworn to end this thread. I can only respond if the almighty Ron-Mon releases me from my oath.
02/26/06 @ 22:58
Comment from: Patrick [Visitor]
If this is the case, these girls should head on over to the PGA, because we have seen winners with those driving averages.

These averages make Michelle look like a little girl...
02/26/06 @ 23:15
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Patrick,

THANK YOU FOR GETTING US BACK TO GOLF!!!

Your question can most properly be answered by Norman or Jim COULTHARD, however I think there is probably no skullduggery involved. Remember that the 2006 stats for the LPGA are based on only two tournaments. If the majority of the shots recorded came on downhill fairways, these results would not be extraordinary. I am not sure about the SBS, but I believe that was the case at the Fields.

I know in the Fields several of the ladies were bypassing driver and going for fairway woods and irons and this is often the case with downhill fairways.

Norman, Jim any insights here?

Jennifer Mario, any comments from someone who was at the scene of the purported crime?
02/26/06 @ 23:21
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
UnderPar, John Neal has officially bailed out and is now OWNED! He started the usage flap and now he can't stand the heat. "Alright" is not now, nor has it ever been, proper usage. It is not even a word, at least in the English language. I can't figure out where in hell he ever came up with some of his absurd theories about adverbs and adjectives. Proper use of these parts of speech is quite definitive and clear.
02/26/06 @ 23:23
Comment from: Alex [Visitor]
John Neal, it's not GRAMMER, it's GRAMMAR, for goodness sake!
02/26/06 @ 23:30
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
ALEX,

It took you almost an hour to find that? I thought it was a pretty obvious spelling error when I put it in there. :-) Now for Heaven's sake let it be. This is about GOLF.
02/26/06 @ 23:40
Comment from: Patrick [Visitor]
thanks john z for your comments...but I still haven't gotten my question answered...are the LPGA driving averages inflated? Or does the LPGA measure drives on the DOWN-HILL holes only to boost its hype? hmm...
02/27/06 @ 00:31
Comment from: Brian J [Visitor]
John Z,

Are you interested in golf?

If you are, then who is your favorite golfer?




02/27/06 @ 01:04
Comment from: Brian J [Visitor]
Alex,

Who is your favorite golfer?
02/27/06 @ 01:11
Comment from: Brian J [Visitor]
Under Par,

Who is your favorite golfer?
02/27/06 @ 01:13
Comment from: Brian J [Visitor]
Folks,

My favorite golfer is obviously Michelle Wie.
02/27/06 @ 01:15
Comment from: Patrick [Visitor]
My favorite golfer...most fascinating to watch would be Tiger Woods/John Daly/Michelle Wie/ but my FAVORITE golfer would have to be John Daly...no matter would I do I always pull for him always. Maybe because of his
02/27/06 @ 01:54
Comment from: Brian J [Visitor]
"I have high expectations and I'm disappointed when I don't meet them,'' Pressel said after the third round at the Fields Open.

This reminds me of John Z, Alex, Under Par and so forth.

I always almost hear them say "I have high expectations for Michelle Wie and I'm disappointed when Wie doesn't meet my expectation"

I seems to me that they are so frustrated when Wie doesn't meet their expectations that they attack others who don't have as high expectations for Wie as they do.
02/27/06 @ 02:06
Comment from: Brian J [Visitor]
Patrick,

I really appreciate your response.

I would like to say all the best wishes for John Daly.
02/27/06 @ 02:15
Comment from: One-Putt [Visitor]
"Comment from: Patrick [Visitor]
TIME OUT!
I have one question for you all...is the LPGA giving is inflated stats? Because on their Driving Distance List, the leader is at 295.3:"

Patrick of course they don't hit it as long as VJ. These measurements are in ladies yards (feet).

I thought it was really funny when the critics here knocked Michelle's driving average at the Fields. On most of the par fours she hit a five wood for crying out loud. The LPGA only measures distance on one or two par fours in a round, not the entire course average.
02/27/06 @ 03:57
Comment from: Cheryl [Visitor]
I have to say in reading all these posts about Michelle Wie on this blog and others...

I don't understand the hate she engenders from other people.

What exactly has she done to attract so much animosity?

She seems like a great kid , very respectful.

She showed a lot of class over that whole Bamberger mess when she was disqualified--definitely more than Bamberger.

She treats other players with respect, and doesn't make rude, catty comments about others in the media (ala Morgan Pressel )

No golfer in the history of golf has accomplished what she has at age 16.

She has numerous Top 5 finishes on the LPGA tour.

No female golfer has scored as low as her on the PGA tour.

If its her dream to play with the men and women -who are we to stand in her way. Wouldn't we want to follow through on our own dreams especially when we were younger?

You hate her endorsment deals or all the attention she gets ?

Well blame the companies endorsing her and all the media clamoring to cover her not her

You hate her world ranking?

Blame the people who did the calculating and devised the system not her

She's a good kid - leave her alone.
02/27/06 @ 07:14
Comment from: John Neal [Visitor]
Cheryl,
Amen and nicely put.
02/27/06 @ 07:18
Comment from: Jake [Visitor]

Well written Cheryl !

With all the trash talking Morgan Pressel has done in the media about Michelle --and the way Morgan choked at the end of Fields---

If Michelle Wie had wanted to rub her nose in it--she would have every right especially since Michelle has not responded at all to any of Morgan's cattiness.

And you know what no one would have blamed Michelle for firing back but she didn't--

Michelle Wie told the media after the tournament-

"Morgan was a really nice girl, and I hope she does well this year."

What did Morgan say about Michelle when Michelle choked at the end of the Women's Open last year?

Morgan said Michelle didn't know how to win, the media was being politically correct by not focusing too much on how she lost the lead, and that Michelle should have played junior golf like her.

Morgan is the older player with a ton of amateur experience and Morgan is the one always downgrading Michelle Wie-
- yet Morgan Pressel was the one who faded down the stretch--something SHE said she was immune to because she didn't "avoid Junior golf" like Michelle.

I don't see the media focusing too much on Morgan's choke either --are they being politically correct now?

Michelle's "choke job" from the Women's Open happened when she was 15 years old with hardly any amateur experience while Morgan had hers at 17 years old with a TON of amateur experience. That just tells you no one is immune to that happening, and Morgan was foolish to say that because she" knows how to win" that these things can't happen to her.

Karma will always get you so its better conducting yourself with dignity and class.

Michelle Wie is a class act and if some people don't appreciate it then that's their loss.
02/27/06 @ 07:44
Comment from: David [Visitor]
I wish everybody would stop expecting the new triumvirate of ladies golf--Creamer, Pressel and Wie--to like and be good friends with one another.

People used to wonder why Byron Nelson, Ben Hogan and Sam Snead were not friends. I've read that Hogan and Nelson were close friends in the earlier days of Hogan's then-failing career, but later grew apart. Why?

You can't compete against somebody tooth-and-nail for very long before your friendship weakens. I'm sure deep-down Morgan sees Michelle as a nice young lady, but I bet she'd slit her throat just to win the U.S. Women's Open against Michelle.
02/27/06 @ 09:50
Comment from: Patrick [Visitor]
lol...Morgan would have slit Michelle's throat to win ANY tournament the two were matched up against...
02/27/06 @ 10:39
Comment from: David [Visitor]
Yes, but you get my point, right?

That is the nature of any professional sport.

I'm sure Michelle is thinking 'hit that drive in the trees' or 'hit that approach shot in the bunker' while Morgan is playing her shots, and also vice versa.

It happens in all sports among all competitive sportspeople.

When I play match play, I damn hope my opponent shanks his next shot, catches it heavy, etc.

I know golf is supposed to be a 'gentlemen's game,' but winning is still the most important thing. Plus the money.
02/27/06 @ 11:53
Comment from: Jim COULTHARD [Visitor]
I think Michelle Wie was probably focussd on her own game and not what Morgan Pressel was doing. But I am sure both Michelle and Morgan paid a lot of attention to any shot where they might be able to learn something that could help them with their own shot.

I HOPE YOU HIT THE BALL ON THE GREEN JUST BEHIND MY BALL SO I CAN GET A GREAT READ FROM YOUR PUTT WHEN YOU PUTT FIRST.
02/27/06 @ 13:52
Comment from: David [Visitor]
Tiger wouldn't have won his two tournaments this year if it wasn't for the misfortune of others (during the playoffs).

You can play your best game, but at the end of the day, it all boils down to whether or not somebody else beats you, or instead folds down the stretch.
02/27/06 @ 14:42
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
Patrick said:
I have one question for you all...is the LPGA giving is inflated stats? Because on their Driving Distance List, the leader is at 295.3:
****************************

Patrick, you will have to wait for the whole season if you want a more accurate picture of the average driving in lpga tournaments.

Many facts affect driving distance, but I think this will help show you how tournaments vary:

Fields Open Driving Stats:
1st Karin Sjodin 306.2 yards
2nd Brittany Lang 303.5
3rd Sophie Gustafson 299.8
4th Brittany Lincicome 297.8
5th Michelle Wie 293.5
11th Paula Creamer 282.0
17th Morgan Pressel 276.3
26th Cristie Kerr 273.3
30th Ai Miyazato 271.8


SBS Open Driving Stats:
1 Brittany Lincicome 262.5 yards
2 Lorena Ochoa 256.3
3 Katie Futcher 256.2
4 Karen Stupples 253.7
5 Karrie Webb 253.0
14 Paula Creamer 246.3
28 Morgan Pressel 242.8
72 Ai Miyazato 228.3

Basically that shows that anyone who entered the 2nd tournament only should have a very high average.
Over the season it should even itself out to the typical average.
02/27/06 @ 14:48
Comment from: Under Par [Visitor]
Brian,

My favorite golfer is Vijay Singh.

About the women's driving: Patrick, while those aberrant distances were no doubt due to the conditions, generally speaking, they definitely do all they can to make the women look better. I've noticed that while they will tell you the distance a player has hit his drive on the PGA Tour (they flash it on the screen), they won't do this on LPGA broadcasts (I haven't seen it anyway). I think it's pretty obvious that this is for marketing reasons. If the average guy saw that most of the women were only hitting it 240-250, he'd say to himself, "Hey, I can hit it that far!" This would redound negatively upon the LPGA's popularity.

Alex,

Yes, John really got hoisted on his own petards there!
02/27/06 @ 15:35
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
Under Par,
They don't flash up average distances on the European Tour either.

Is this because it would embarass our players?
I think not, because many hit it as far as the pga guys. You should watch Henrik Stenson's power, yet they don't flash up his distances.
I think it is all about money. The pga is just better at getting the info sorted immediately and the commentators get better information.
02/27/06 @ 16:24
Comment from: Under Par [Visitor]
Norman,

I don't think that's the reason for their failure to do so on the women's tour.
02/27/06 @ 16:48
Comment from: David [Visitor]
Under Par,

What do you admire about Vijay Singh, except for his golf game?
02/27/06 @ 17:52
Comment from: Brian [Visitor]
Under Par,

I appreciate your reply.

I wish Vijay all the luck and that he would win 4 majors this year.
02/27/06 @ 18:07
Comment from: Under Par [Visitor]
David,

I hear he bakes a great blueberry cupcake.
02/27/06 @ 19:07
Comment from: Brian [Visitor]
I have no doubt Vijay has enormous talent and he should have won 4 majors last year.

02/27/06 @ 20:12
Comment from: george [Visitor]
** Comment from: John Z [Visitor] · http://John Z
Jnder Par, well I guess you got your comeuppance already. Just wait until Norman gets on your case! YOU will be psychologically fragile! **

A Norman post causes no psychological scars. They only cause boredom.

-George
02/27/06 @ 20:36
Comment from: george [Visitor]
** Comment from: Steve [Visitor]
I'm sure you conveniently forgot about Creamer's mediocre performance for being a #2 player---and Morgan's bogey-bogey finish..

That amateur experience really helped them there **

Steve, you simply demonstrate how thick you are.

The amateur experience has helped Creamer in the very recent past. In recent months, Paula has won four tournaments, two on the LPGA, and she led the U.S. to a Solheim Cup victory.

As for Michelle ... has she won her first LPGA tournament?

You likely will dislike hearing this, but a lack of Wie wins impedes The Marketing of Michelle Wie.

-George
02/27/06 @ 20:44
Comment from: george [Visitor]
** Comment from: Cheryl [Visitor]
I have to say in reading all these posts about Michelle Wie on this blog and others...

I don't understand the hate she engenders from other people. **

Cheryl, please assure us that you're not as obtuse and crazed as, say, John Neal, June, Jim C., and Norman.

You do get it, right?

It's not Michelle Wie. I have absolutely no idea what Michelle is like in real life. She could be Teen Mother Theresa. She could pull wings off flies while waiting for a putting lesson.

It could be none of the above. I have no idea. And neither do you.

But what is an endless source of amusement are people such as you and the other Wie Warriors who desperately need to fawn over Michelle.

The key factor is whether Michelle has her first LPGA win or first PGA cut. So far, she has not. Her lack of wins is a matter of scrutiny, given the media's decision to award Michelle prominence.

Only slightly secondary in importance is Michelle's FANS and their lunatic fervor.

Michelle seems like a pleasant enough individual WRT her public persona. Of course, with $10 million in the bank, her public persona is, I'm confident, meticulously sculpted and burnished.

But what is absolutely crystal is the paranoia, defensiveness, obsession, and inadequacy of the Wie Warriors.

Be smart, Sheryl. Learn the truth about your fellow maniacs.

-George
02/27/06 @ 21:07
Comment from: george [Visitor]
To David and Patrick:

David said:
** You can't compete against somebody tooth-and-nail for very long before your friendship weakens. I'm sure deep-down Morgan sees Michelle as a nice young lady, but I bet she'd slit her throat just to win the U.S. Women's Open against Michelle. **

Do you apply this competitive drive to Michelle Wie?

Specifically, would you also make the corollary statement, to wit:

"David is sure that deep-down Michelle sees Morgan as a nice young lady, but David bets Michelle would slit Morgan's throat just to win the U.S. Women's Open against Morgan."

Because if you don't agree with that statement -- or disown your original statement -- then perhaps the hate in this thread is being directed not at Michelle Wie ... but at Morgan Pressel.

-George
02/27/06 @ 21:15
Comment from: Patrick [Visitor]
What was the question you had for me george? Didn't see in it in your post...only saw david's quotes...

Anyway, 60 minutes did a interview on Michelle today at school (their follow up from last year's interview). There were huge cameras and lights and all the jazz, she even had some of her friends join in on the taping...so I guess the matter of fact is Michelle draws crowds and tv ratings...kind of like a tigeresque or Daly-esque aura don't you think?

I personally love Morgan and Michelle. They are two fantastic golfers with tremendous talent...what I don't appreciate is how Morgan attacks her fellow competitors stating so and so, but when she comes face to face with her "biggest" rival...she doesn't seem to have the actions to back up her statements. morgan has repeatedly said that She is a closer who knows how to close the deal and win. This is very true in the AMATEUR RANKS, and she has gone even further stating that Michelle did not play amateur events as to the extent of Morgan in which she could "LEARN HOW TO WIN" and not choke. Morgan did exactly the opposite of those statements in which she praised herself as a closer, ending with two-bogeys going from a T5th to T11th.

I'm sure Morgan wanted birdies and became aggressive at the end, but if she really knew how to close, she would not have made those mistakes.

Anyway...I hope in Michelle's next tournament she gets paired up with someone like Paula or maybe even a natalie gulbis...christina kim maybe? That would be fun to watch.
02/27/06 @ 21:52
Comment from: Joe Cool [Visitor]
The biggest nemesis for Michelle the last three years has been the straight four foot putt. Hopefully, she will get that monkey off her back very soon. She had a four foot putt on the 13th and misread it for just outside right edge, when it was a straight putt. Maybe at the Nabisco she will right the ship.

For the Wie haters...did you shoot under par (from the tips) when you were 16 years old?? I didn't think so!
02/27/06 @ 22:16
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
Joe Cool,

I think Wie has a good chance at the Nabisco. If she were playing more events at that time, I would give her an excellent chance.

Instead the lpga championship, might be a very good bet. If Annika doesn't bring her A-game, I would class Michelle Wie as the favourite.
02/28/06 @ 09:17
Comment from: David [Visitor]
George said:

>> Do you apply this competitive drive to Michelle Wie?

Specifically, would you also make the corollary statement, to wit:

"David is sure that deep-down Michelle sees Morgan as a nice young lady, but David bets Michelle would slit Morgan's throat just to win the U.S. Women's Open against Morgan."

Yes, George, it goes both ways. In all sports, I believe. I'm sure Under Par would confirm that a similar sort of thing happens in tennis (gamesmanship, really, but only inside one's head), as I believe he is a tennis pro.
02/28/06 @ 10:39
Comment from: James COULTHARD [Visitor]
PATRICK

Next tournament hope that Michelle plays with Annika during the final round--that, presumeably, would be the fianl pairing.

JOE COOL

If you remember evey 4 foot putt Michelle Wie misses, and forget all the ones she makes, then it will certainly look like she has trouble with such putts. I wonder how well she does if we take all such putts into account.

DAVID

All tennis is match play, and so is a lot of amateur golf--but most professional golf is stroke play. Gamesmanship is far less important. Indeed, I wonder whether extensive experience with the match play format, such as Morgan Pressel has, might not be a disadvantge when you are going to play almost entirely stroke play tournaments. Presumeably it depends upon the individual.

03/01/06 @ 13:10
Comment from: Norman [Visitor]
James,
I had extensive experience in match play situations as an amateur.
As you suggested, I did find the adjustment massive in professional tournaments and more stroke play.

It is a very different situation. In match play, you tend to play alot of shots based on what someone else does.
In stroke play you really need to concentrate on your own game.
03/01/06 @ 14:07
Comment from: Mary [Visitor]
Ya know, if everyone took all their fervor off the keyboard and took it to the driving range, we'd all be dropping our handicaps. I'm sure Baldie and Tim would be sad to lose the traffic, but since
no one is going to change anyone's mind through the blogs (although you might learn about some fascinating pathologies - some of the anti-woman stuff is actually kind of scary), so why break cerebral arteries trying? Cheap Bastard would enjoy getting more hits as we research good spots to play.

I'm off to smack some balls - it's a much better use of energy. Maybe this year I'll actually break 100.

Mary

03/03/06 @ 09:38
Comment from: Under Par [Visitor]
I'm off to smack some balls - it's a much better use of energy. Maybe this year I'll actually break 100.

Mary

That seems doubtful, Mary. You're only a girl.
03/03/06 @ 16:21

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